Who I want off team USA in O & B

[banditshcky11]

In order because they all fit the Flyers mold...

Dustin Brown
David Backes
TJ Oshi
Max Pac (yes he convinced me)
Kevin Shattenkirk
Ryan Suter(he's last because he's unattainable)

Now go get me them all Paul!!!


Those guys played insane today and I'm starting to see what all the fuss about Kessel is, even though I still think he's a tad over rated and will be massively over paid.

Also thank god for DVR since a 7:30 am game is just balls.

 

[banditshcky11]

sorry for the randomness of this I just watched the game and got pretty excited that they actually seemed to have fully functioning and working game plan.

 

[awaz]

Backes
Shattenkirk
Jvr
Oshi
Suter

Is my order. Still like the jvr for schenn trade because it was surplus for deficit, but jvr has looked mighty good.

 

[Progeriakid]

Backes
Shattenkirk
Jvr
Oshi
Suter

Is my order. Still like the jvr for schenn trade because it was surplus for deficit, but jvr has looked mighty good.

100% agreed, JVR has looked dominant in front of the net and I still want him over Luke anyday of the week and twice on sundays!

 

[banditshcky11]

I'm not sure why but I'm convinced from watching the Olympics is that the Flyers have a lack of strong 2 way players in their top 6. I'm not saying that theyre bad defensively, just that they don't excell at playing a 2 way game. As a huge JVR fan I'll be the first to admit that he looked and still does look lost in his defensive zone. I would just love to see the Flyers as an organization take more of a StL Blues approach and build a team of strong 2 way players with a few pure scorers tossed in. That was how I arrived at my list at least.

 

[lasgop8]

100% agreed, JVR has looked dominant in front of the net and I still want him over Luke anyday of the week and twice on sundays!

JVR never stood anywhere near the net when he played for us it was like he was alergic to the crease when he was in Philly . He has changed his game to let Kessel do all the work and play a more of Wayne Simmods type of game but certainly not as good as Wayne trains all around game.

 

[awaz]

I'm not sure why but I'm convinced from watching the Olympics is that the Flyers have a lack of strong 2 way players in their top 6. I'm not saying that theyre bad defensively, just that they don't excell at playing a 2 way game. As a huge JVR fan I'll be the first to admit that he looked and still does look lost in his defensive zone. I would just love to see the Flyers as an organization take more of a StL Blues approach and build a team of strong 2 way players with a few pure scorers tossed in. That was how I arrived at my list at least.

i actually think giroux and voracek are the only two players who have any semblance of a 2-way game in the flyers top 6.. and even with them, it's only when they feel like it. they can both back check with the best of them, but the desire to isn't always there.

simmonds' defensive play has been much improved this year though

 

[lasgop8]

i actually think giroux and voracek are the only two players who have any semblance of a 2-way game in the flyers top 6.. and even with them, it's only when they feel like it. they can both back check with the best of them, but the desire to isn't always there.

simmonds' defensive play has been much improved this year though

Awaz i dont know if your including Schenn in the top 6 but i dont think your giving B Bchenn enough credit for his ability to back check. He comes back with the best of anyone on our team. Only better guys on the team at coming back are Simmonds and Voracek.

 

[banditshcky11]

Awaz i dont know if your including Schenn in the top 6 but i dont think your giving B Bchenn enough credit for his ability to back check. He comes back with the best of anyone on our team. Only better guys on the team at coming back are Simmonds and Voracek.

I have to admit i think there is a lot of confusion in who our top 6 is this season with all the line juggling so I will go through what I believe ours is and then categorize their 2 way playing ability IMO.

Hartnell - Giroux - Vorachek
Lecavlier- B. Schenn - Simmonds


Now B. Schenn and Giroux are both excellent 2 way players I believe and more so the best 2 back checkers we currently have in our top 6. I say this not only because they both read plays so well on when to rotate back when the D is pinching but also because while back checking they read where they need to be so well. I can't count the number of times I've seen these two go the full length of the ice to then go in behind our goal to out number, out work and support the D and inevitably get the puck out of our zone.

Vorachek and Simmonds fit into the middle category. Now Vorachek is definitely the one guy on this team I want chasing down the play on a 2 on 1 going towards Mason because this is where he excels at back checking but if you watch neither he nor Simmonds are very adept at reading where they need to go to be in a supportive role once they back check. They gravitate towards the play if you will.

Hartnell & Lecavilier are IMO the worst of our top 6 back checkers, they lack the speed at thsi point to really get back in plays and break them up and most of the time they stop back checking somewhere in between our blue line and the top of the face off dot. This isn't really the most productive thing to do because again they seem to not go to supportive positions.

As far as our 3rd line ( Read - Couturier - Downie), I have no issues with any of their play I think they make up the perfect complimentary 2 way 3rd line and as long as they aren't being relied on to put up too much offense (since they're a more defensive minded unit anyway) they won't let you down.




So far I think the one thing that the US team exemplifies is how 2 way hockey wins games and creates scoring opportunities. Now I may be crazy but I think this is the system that Berube has been trying to implement since taking the reigns. Some games it works great but other we've seen there's been tons of confusion in coverages. I think the biggest difference (minus the overall skill difference of the US team vs the Flyers) is the way that the US team seems to have predetermined supportive back checking areas that they revert to when they're unsure where they need to be, this makes things much easier on the defense and other players surrounding the play because they have at least a vague idea of where everyone else is and it leads to easier clears and tons of great break outs.

I know my list is merely a dream but I thought it would be fun and interesting to discuss the great success the US team has had to date and hopefully to pinpoint some things that the Flyers management should be looking to take away from watching them.

 

[banditshcky11]

Right now this is very much a win by committee team and I personally think that's a great thing because looking at the Western Conference (the StL Blues in particular) I think that's the direction the NHL is taking now. I just hope that this group is allowed to grow and no knee jerk moves are made (unless it's taking advantage of being able to move a NMC/NTC contract for a decent return) because I see a ton of talent here in our youngsters and lots of potential moving forward. I still think we're 1-2 years away from planning a parade but as we've seen in recent years any team who get hot in the playoffs can be dangerous.

 

[awaz]

i was including schenn in my top 6.. i haven't seen him doing anything extrodinary and i've seen him get beat a few times.. but maybe i need to pay more attention to him defensively

 

[JBM73]

i was including schenn in my top 6.. i haven't seen him doing anything extrodinary and i've seen him get beat a few times.. but maybe i need to pay more attention to him defensively

I would agree with your assessment of B Schenn. Yes he hustles, but he's still learning the finer points of playing D. He's too often out of position and/or loses his man. He's improving though, but he still has a ways to go.

 

[banditshcky11]

I would agree with your assessment of B Schenn. Yes he hustles, but he's still learning the finer points of playing D. He's too often out of position and/or loses his man. He's improving though, but he still has a ways to go.

I've seen lots of Flyers lose their men, I think it could possibly be more of a system issue though. I mean that players seemingly get confused on when they're supposed to switch men on defensive coverages in certain areas of the ice, the worst place I've noticed this is in high to the mid slot. With Schenn I personally feel he's taken huge steps into become an excellent 2 way player this season, he still has his scoring slumps but he gets to the dirty areas and he's hustling all over the ice and making opposing players pay to make plays. He really does remind me of Richards a lot but with a better overall yet still raw skill set. I think the one defensive area he excels at is battling behind our goal and providing good support and options for the D men to get the puck up ice.

 

[JBM73]

I've seen lots of Flyers lose their men, I think it could possibly be more of a system issue though. I mean that players seemingly get confused on when they're supposed to switch men on defensive coverages in certain areas of the ice, the worst place I've noticed this is in high to the mid slot. With Schenn I personally feel he's taken huge steps into become an excellent 2 way player this season, he still has his scoring slumps but he gets to the dirty areas and he's hustling all over the ice and making opposing players pay to make plays. He really does remind me of Richards a lot but with a better overall yet still raw skill set. I think the one defensive area he excels at is battling behind our goal and providing good support and options for the D men to get the puck up ice.

The Flyers better defensive forwards find themselves getting at least occasional PK time. Even if they're not in the regular rotation, they get the occasional call due to a regular PKer in the box or injured. I can't recall ever having seen Schenn out on the PK. Why? Because he's not one of the Flyers better defensive forwards. He's not a Richards type, who played strong defense first and then developed his offense. Laughton is more likely to be Richards-lite, although I question how well his offense will develop. Schenn has always been a score-first type of player. However, because his offense hasn't yet developed as expected at the NHL level, he's been forced to improve his D in order to maintain ice time. I think he still has a chance to develop into a very good player, perhaps not quite what was expected but still very good. I don't see him ever being much more than average defensively, though. He just doesn't seem to have that defensive instinct that guys like Richards and Couturier have. Just my thoughts, and I totally respect you having a different opinion. I actually hope you turn out to be right and he develops into a strong 2-way player.

 

[awaz]

The Flyers better defensive forwards find themselves getting at least occasional PK time. Even if they're not in the regular rotation, they get the occasional call due to a regular PKer in the box or injured. I can't recall ever having seen Schenn out on the PK. Why? Because he's not one of the Flyers better defensive forwards. He's not a Richards type, who played strong defense first and then developed his offense. Laughton is more likely to be Richards-lite, although I question how well his offense will develop. Schenn has always been a score-first type of player. However, because his offense hasn't yet developed as expected at the NHL level, he's been forced to improve his D in order to maintain ice time. I think he still has a chance to develop into a very good player, perhaps not quite what was expected but still very good. I don't see him ever being much more than average defensively, though. He just doesn't seem to have that defensive instinct that guys like Richards and Couturier have. Just my thoughts, and I totally respect you having a different opinion. I actually hope you turn out to be right and he develops into a strong 2-way player.

yep i agree with all this.

 

[DaBoltsNIsles]

That's a nice list. Now how would the Flyers be able to fit them all under the cap?:

 

[ChicagoIrish]

I'll tell you what, we'll send you Pat Kane, and you can send us Claude Giroux

 

[FlyerFinFan]

I'll tell you what, we'll send you Pat Kane, and you can send us Claude Giroux

I heard from pen fans that kunitz was the best power forward in hockey maybe you should trade for him....

 

[awaz]

Olli Matta.. *sigh*

 

[FlyerFinFan]

Olli Matta.. *sigh*

Ya I was thinking that too....we need D and go forward yet he's already playing a regular NHL shift. that was definitely a miss on Homers part he was also ranked highly so it wasn't a reach!

On another note the JVR we know and love disappeared again.....I'm still backing the Luke trade he's going to giver this playoffs!