my honest appraisal of RG3 and questions on what to do

[skinsdad62]

first and foremost he isnt a franchise qb .. we gave up the picks for a franchise guy but as it stands now he isnt .

he does in fact hold the ball too long . young running qbs tend to do that and hopefully over time he can get over that

he is way too injury prone so far . you cant be a franchise guy if you arent on the field

he is a huge help in the run game as Am's stats have shown ? why ? because defenses have to respect the read option play give AM better match-ups

his arm strength is very good , his accuracy is on most occasions good

so where do we go from here hater crowd ? or strong criticism crowd , or pocket passer crowd ? you all are a huge parade of bitcher's calling out the issue but lack any real solutions

well there are 2 ways to win
1) build around avg qb and let the skill [players o/line and defense carry avg qb to wins or

2) find superior pocket passer who raises the play of others around him via draft or trade and he carries mediocre team to victory

well there are 2 ways to attack this problem

1) Rg3 isnt salvageable and we need the new qb to come in . Fine fair enough to me because like it or not you cant invest too much more time in Rg3 . at this point even i say you cant give him the 5th year extension . that simply hasnt been earned yet

do you believe that Rg3 can carry us on his shoulders to the promised land and make up for an avg team a la peyton manning ?

so who do you target ? do you stick with KC and hope he can read defenses , stop rushing his throws and turning the ball over in rex type fashion ?

do you think KC is the guy who can carry a team ? and if not do you go with him to be avg and build the team around him ?

what about colt ? do you believe his texas career means more then what his pro career has shown . do you believe he can carry us to the promised land a la peyton manning ? he does have the best pocket awareness on the team and he is mobile . do you think he is avg and can you build the team around him ?


that is our in house solution . admit that our qbs are avg , build the team around whomever you pick and let the team do the heavy lifting

that would mean an end to the whining about Rg3's cost etc because frankly guys that ship has sailed . gripe all you want and go round and round with that till your hearts content but at the end of the day we still have what we have and when i have eaten all the crow you want to feed me it will still be the same

now the 2nd way is to trade , sign or draft the qb who can carry the team . the elusive franchise qb of your dreams

well lets looks at some candidates shall we ? first at the NFL level

i see really 2 viable candidates

1) sam bradford . he is injury prone but when he has played he has done well . his career starting record isnt great but some on this board were perfectly fine with gutting a couple of drafts to get him . he certainly has the talent . he could be signed for a reasonable amount because his cap number is oppressive

2) matt ryan qb , he was a number 3 overall draft pick and has had some good seasons . he is taking abuse now in atlanta and he could cost some draft picks to get him but you would get the pocket passer you covet

now for the draft

i could go over prospect , marriotta , winston , tricket , hundley etc but all have flaws
i will let you guys decide if the guy is there

so there you have it . dont respond to this with the same old Rg3 this or Rg3 that we are passed that now
the griping is done now its time to come up with the solution , a viable one , not the get rid of snyder nonsense or allen is a bum .

i want straight up plans not "pot stirring " not a history lesson " not "i told you so's "

 

[KickSaveDave]

It won't matter who our QB is if we don't fix the middle of the OL, so I'd ride out RGIII for one more year and focus on the OL this offseason. Then if RGIII does improve, he'll have more help around him. If he doesn't, then we look for a new QB for the 2016 season.

I would literally go OL with our 1st and 2nd round picks in this draft and maybe add a free agent. I would also throw Long and LeRibeye in there NOW because Lavau and Chester are useless. Lets see if those guys can play while we have some time left in the season. If not, move on from Ribs and let Long develop another year.

Neither Ryan or Bradford are any sort of solution, but not sure a replacement is available for 2015. Look to 2016 and fix the rest of the mess.

 

[Sharkinva]

Its a book. But the simple honest answer is this.

Let him ride out the season and if he does not show real improvement in his problem areas, you have to bring in some one to compete.

Kirk has to go no matter what. I dont think you can give him the chance to start, and even if they made it an open competition I dont think it would really be open. We will likely have to ride RG3 this year and next. I agree he hasnt earned the 5th year. So if he hasnt become the man by the end of next year, time to move on. Like him or not, we have to many other holes to throw more picks at QB right now. And I think the fanbase would revolt if Kirk were named the starter or even allowed to compete for the job.

 

[skinz2winz]

Its a book. But the simple honest answer is this.

Let him ride out the season and if he does not show real improvement in his problem areas, you have to bring in some one to compete.

Kirk has to go no matter what. I dont think you can give him the chance to start, and even if they made it an open competition I dont think it would really be open. We will likely have to ride RG3 this year and next. I agree he hasnt earned the 5th year. So if he hasnt become the man by the end of next year, time to move on. Like him or not, we have to many other holes to throw more picks at QB right now. And I think the fanbase would revolt if Kirk were named the starter or even allowed to compete for the job.

Fans, if they had an idea of how football should be played, would revolt because KC isn't very good at all.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

It won't matter who our QB is if we don't fix the middle of the OL, so I'd ride out RGIII for one more year and focus on the OL this offseason. Then if RGIII does improve, he'll have more help around him. If he doesn't, then we look for a new QB for the 2016 season.

I would literally go OL with our 1st and 2nd round picks in this draft and maybe add a free agent. I would also throw Long and LeRibeye in there NOW because Lavau and Chester are useless. Lets see if those guys can play while we have some time left in the season. If not, move on from Ribs and let Long develop another year.

Neither Ryan or Bradford are any sort of solution, but not sure a replacement is available for 2015. Look to 2016 and fix the rest of the mess.

Agree for the most part on the O-line. However - I don't think that you have to go overboard on the O-line. I think that you would be amazed at the difference in even adding one stud lineman to the mix. That person will likely improve the play of everyone else dramatically & the Skins still have several young players on the roster who may develop over the next year or two. My pt is that you could add a first rounder and a 2nd OR a free agent & it could do wonders. You still have to leave room for some additions on defense.

I would also - again - add that this team needs to significantly improve in the scouting dept (perhaps upgrades are already being planned) to ensure that they not only use their picks to get lineman but also make the right picks.

Good ideas Dave. BTW - if you head up to Joxers over the next month or so I bet that you get a front row seat.

 

[KickSaveDave]

Agree for the most part on the O-line. However - I don't think that you have to go overboard on the O-line. I think that you would be amazed at the difference in even adding one stud lineman to the mix. That person will likely improve the play of everyone else dramatically & the Skins still have several young players on the roster who may develop over the next year or two. My pt is that you could add a first rounder and a 2nd OR a free agent & it could do wonders. You still have to leave room for some additions on defense.

I would also - again - add that this team needs to significantly improve in the scouting dept (perhaps upgrades are already being planned) to ensure that they not only use their picks to get lineman but also make the right picks.

Good ideas Dave. BTW - if you head up to Joxers over the next month or so I bet that you get a front row seat.

Does Joxers have a special section where I can crawl into the fetal position and cry myself to sleep?

 

[Sharkinva]

Fans, if they had an idea of how football should be played, would revolt because KC isn't very good at all.

Tired of the same old argument. But that is the RG3 fan boy talking. IF we cant really determine how good or bad Griffin is after a year of him trying to be a pocket passer, how can you determine that another player with less playing time isnt very good.

Never mind dont bother to answer.

 

[j_y19]

Its too early to call RG3 a bust. But you analysis to date is accurate. Play him the rest of the season no matter how he plays. If he doesn't show any signs of improvement, then look for alternatives out there to bring in to compete with Robert next year. This most likely will not be a rookie, but a vet on another roster. Thus most likely not a current starter. KC and Colt are not the answer, but let them compete also. Do not use draft picks on another QB next draft, but do as Dave suggested and go heavy at OL and S. I would consider trading down to pick up another late 1st or early 2nd, giving us 3 picks in the first 40 or so. We should be able to land a couple of stud OL as well as a stud S.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

Does Joxers have a special section where I can crawl into the fetal position and cry myself to sleep?

I can almost guarantee that several Skins fans have already done that numerous times. Your problem will probably be the long, long drive home.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

Its too early to call RG3 a bust. But you analysis to date is accurate. Play him the rest of the season no matter how he plays. If he doesn't show any signs of improvement, then look for alternatives out there to bring in to compete with Robert next year. This most likely will not be a rookie, but a vet on another roster. Thus most likely not a current starter. KC and Colt are not the answer, but let them compete also. Do not use draft picks on another QB next draft, but do as Dave suggested and go heavy at OL and S. I would consider trading down to pick up another late 1st or early 2nd, giving us 3 picks in the first 40 or so. We should be able to land a couple of stud OL as well as a stud S.

Agree. Also - especially with your suggestion about trading down - points out the need for the Redskins to make it their goal to have one of the best scouting depts in the NFL - cost be damned.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

I've been asking for 2 days for a better solution proposal from the haters but I never got one. But we've finally got something to work with, unfortunately it's only "bring in someone to compete". We need more than that. Better QBs aren't so easy to find, we should know that after 20 years of searching. Make that 30 years, I don't count 2 good years from Mark Rypien to be the solution.

So where do you propose we find "someone to compete" and what argument could you make that convinces us that this guy will be better? Again please show your work

 

[skinz2winz]

Tired of the same old argument. But that is the RG3 fan boy talking. IF we cant really determine how good or bad Griffin is after a year of him trying to be a pocket passer, how can you determine that another player with less playing time isnt very good.

Never mind dont bother to answer.

Your a hater, always will be a hater because of what we gave up to get Griffin. That wasn't Griffin who asked for such a deal or to even come to DC. You ignore what he did in year 1 (Carried this team on his back to an NFCE title) because he sustained 2 injuries that would be hard for anyone to overcome and really has not played much since. I carry hope that he can become the QB to lead this once proud franchise back to relevance which I think he can once we improve up front and on defense.

To answer your question about KC, it's pretty simple. He turns the ball over far too frequently and in this league, once your labeled a TO machine, you are done as a starter. I have respected your opinions over the years Shark on Redskins related topics however, I do not respect or agree with your opinion on Griffin, your reasoning of whom he should be already as a QB because of what the organization gave up to draft him, or of your opinion of what Griffin will become as a QB the remaining part of this year or next.

 

[j_y19]

I've been asking for 2 days for a better solution proposal from the haters. I haven't heard one, just more critical comments. But we've finally got something to work with, unfortunately it's
only "bring in someone to compete". We need more than that. Better QBs aren't so easy to find, we should know that after 20 years of searching. Make that 30 years, I don't count 2 good years from Mark Rypien to be the solution.

So where do you propose we find "someone to compete" and what argument could you make that convinces us that this guy will be better? Again please show your work

As I said, it will not be a current starter, but a QB like Cousins that has been parked on the bench for a few years but is talented. I haven't looked at NFL rosters close enough to have names. But they are out there. They may or may not solve the problem. But what they will do is potentially light a fire under RG3's ass in that he is now in an open competition for his career. He's never been in that situation. Colt and KC will not beat him out. If it comes to this, we need new blood.

Or we could do what you seem to believe and put RG3 on a pedestal and continue to tell him that he is the best, smartest, most valuable player on the team and he can do what ever he wants. I assume this is what you want since you didn't offer anything but criticism of other's suggestions.

 

[j_y19]

The other option would be to try and trade RG3. We might find a sucker to give us a 1st (Oakland and Dallas come to mind). But then we would have to find his replacement.

 

[Sharkinva]

Your a hater, always will be a hater because of what we gave up to get Griffin. That wasn't Griffin who asked for such a deal or to even come to DC. You ignore what he did in year 1 (Carried this team on his back to an NFCE title) because he sustained 2 injuries that would be hard for anyone to overcome and really has not played much since. I carry hope that he can become the QB to lead this once proud franchise back to relevance which I think he can once we improve up front and on defense.

To answer your question about KC, it's pretty simple. He turns the ball over far too frequently and in this league, once your labeled a TO machine, you are done as a starter. I have respected your opinions over the years Shark on Redskins related topics however, I do not respect or agree with your opinion on Griffin, your reasoning of whom he should be already as a QB because of what the organization gave up to draft him, or of your opinion of what Griffin will become as a QB the remaining part of this year or next.

Get it right dude, I didnt want him even before we made the trade because to me he was just a nicer more accurate version of Vick. So if that makes me a hater, you know what.. you are right I will own it. Im a hater. And you are a fan boy and thus you judge Cousins based on your fanboy love of RG3. And i dont ignore what he did year one. Even a broke dick dog gets to hump something once in a while. Year one was the fluke.

 

[skinsdad62]

Its a book. But the simple honest answer is this.

Let him ride out the season and if he does not show real improvement in his problem areas, you have to bring in some one to compete.

Kirk has to go no matter what. I dont think you can give him the chance to start, and even if they made it an open competition I dont think it would really be open. We will likely have to ride RG3 this year and next. I agree he hasnt earned the 5th year. So if he hasnt become the man by the end of next year, time to move on. Like him or not, we have to many other holes to throw more picks at QB right now. And I think the fanbase would revolt if Kirk were named the starter or even allowed to compete for the job.

i had to write a book to come out with all the options

but gathering what i can from your response its business as usual with no real plan to fix it no draft pick to draft , no veteran to come in and perform

even though you have written him off already ? why stick with a guy you feel sucks ? is it that hard for you to come out and say lets look at this guy or that pick ?

 

[skinsdad62]

i guess some of you didnt get the last few sentences

i said the griping is done now so no more of that

give up some solutions and hopefully some names not the fictional "bring some guy in " or "a draft pick "

name them . let us know what you are looking for and who fits the bill

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Get it right dude, I didnt want him even before we made the trade because to me he was just a nicer more accurate version of Vick. So if that makes me a hater, you know what.. you are right I will own it. Im a hater. And you are a fan boy and thus you judge Cousins based on your fanboy love of RG3. And i dont ignore what he did year one. Even a broke dick dog gets to hump something once in a while. Year one was the fluke.

Unlike you we judged both Cousins and Griffin fairly, by what they did on the field and not by what the teeam did or did not give up for them. You dismiss the entire 2012 season as a fluke yet continued to hang your hat on one good game by Cousins that year, in Cleveland.

We tried to explain to you what Cousins was. You excused it away by claiming the last 3 games last year somehow did not count. Then you call the Griff fans who have acknowledges Griff's shortcomings as nothing more than excuse makers. Then Cousins turns out to be exactly what I told you he was. Seriously dude how can we take your opinion on the QB seriously after what I've seen from you.

 

[skinsdad62]

Unlike you we judged both Cousins and Griffin fairly, by what they did on the field and not by what the teeam did or did not give up for them. You dismiss 2012 as a fluke but failed to listen when we tried to explain to you what Cousins was. He turned out to be exactly as we had said.

in all fairness it is too early to give up on KC either . His game is different . he relies on pre snap . if he knows what up he does well more experience could help there

however he wasnt the panacea he was made out to be either

but back to the plan at QB

 

[j_y19]

OK, here are a couple of names. TJ Yates. Matt Moore. Brian Hoyer. Derek Anderson. Ryan Mallett. Matt Flynn. Mark Sanchez. Not world beaters by any means, but they are all experienced pocket passers that could do well in a gruden style offense. Oh, and they are all FAs next year.