Draft Night Thread

[msgkings322]

I really don't have a problem with the Giants selecting as many pitchers as they did because really, that is the only thing the Giants have shown a consistency in developing. Our current pitching staff (and guys like Durty) prove that point. If we have continued success in drafting and developing arms, we stand a chance to actually "successfully" pulling off a trade centered around pitching prospects to acquire a bat.

Yep, it's our core competency (business speak) / competitive advantage (econ speak). Maximize gains from trade.

 

[gp956]

Yep, it's our core competency (business speak) / competitive advantage -2 (econ speak). Maximize gains from trade.

Comparative advantage!

 

[msgkings322]

Comparative advantage!

Ah shit, yes. I Huffed that one. Been many years since those classes...

 

[dredinis21]

Bottom line is that Durty netted us our most productive bat this season thus far. Melky has been Bonds-send since donning the french vanilla and if we can duplicate this a couple more times, we can potentially have a formidable lineup.

Then again, we DID trade with KC, which is like Lloyd Christmas getting money for a dead bird by trading it with the blind kid in his apartment building.

 

[MarcoPolo]

Bottom line is that Durty netted us our most productive bat this season thus far. Melky has been Bonds-send since donning the french vanilla and if we can duplicate this a couple more times, we can potentially have a formidable lineup.

Then again, we DID trade with KC, which is like Lloyd Christmas getting money for a dead bird by trading it with the blind kid in his apartment building.

I so miss Dave Littlefield, he who swallowed so much in terms of bad Giants trades ...

 

[CameronFrye]

Panda. 33 HR per year average, if you project out from last year and into this year. You asked for one.

That is the biggest line of bullshit I have read on these threads in a long time. Anyone can project the numbers they want to see. Pablo Sandoval has NEVER hit 30 in a single season, let alone averaged it over the course of his career. And that doesn't even factor in the fact that he has missed at least 10 games a year every year in his career.

Nate Schierholtz has 3 HR in 98 ABs this season. If I project him for the standard 550-600 ABs a regular OF has, he's a 20-home run player. WOO HOO!!!

If I had tried to post that as a serious post, I would be laughed off the boards. The very same logic should apply to your statement.

The bottom line here is that you and I and everyone here who reads this knows that Sandoval is not a 30-HR hitter.

 

[CameronFrye]

Fair enough. I too want that bat but everything affects everything else. The $ it would take to get that bat immediately would mean losing a pitcher or three. This is the curse of rooting for a team with some kind of budget constraint. Also the curse of once having Teh Bonds on your side.

Also, if we DID get that bat and surround him with Panda, Posey, and Melky, you'd have Crawford level hitting everywhere else in the order.

That's the only way we get that bat, draft one and hope he's ready in 3 years, or pay way too much for one and lose Timmy and a few pen guys.

I'm glad we're at least upper third in payroll and not the As or Pirates. I'm also glad that whatever it is Sabean is doing, he wins a lot of years and has won a ring and almost won two, more than many team's fans can say.

This line of "logic" is one I don't understand. The Giants have PLENTY of money. This team has operated at a net profit every year it has been in AT&T Park. Rowand, Huff, Freddy, and Wilson come off the books this season. Zito next season. That's $40 million in savings in two years. Factor in raises for Posey, Panda and Melky and there is still money left over to go get a bat. So the money is there. By the time Bumgarner is ready for his big reward, Timmeh has moved on and the stadium is paid off, so the money coming in is ALL surplus. You all have to stop thinking that the Giants are on a fixed budget. They are not. They HAVE the money. Sabean just has to spend it more wisely.

 

[gp956]

That is the biggest line of bullshit I have read on these threads in a long time. Anyone can project the numbers they want to see. Pablo Sandoval has NEVER hit 30 in a single season, let alone averaged it over the course of his career. And that doesn't even factor in the fact that he has missed at least 10 games a year every year in his career.

Nate Schierholtz has 3 HR in 98 ABs this season. If I project him for the standard 550-600 ABs a regular OF has, he's a 20-home run player. WOO HOO!!!

If I had tried to post that as a serious post, I would be laughed off the boards. The very same logic should apply to your statement.

The bottom line here is that you and I and everyone here who reads this knows that Sandoval is not a 30-HR hitter.

LOL. Pretty big over reaction on your part. In 141 games in 2011-2012 he's hit 28 HR. Give him a full healthy year and he's a 30 HR guy. You might also consider he's 25 and just now approaching the age at which power peaks. I thought you knew baseball?

p.s. and about the Nate analogy, strawman of course. Stop with the bullshit logic fails. You know that ain't going to fly on this board.

 

[CameronFrye]

LOL. Pretty big over reaction on your part. In 141 games in 2011-2012 he's hit 28 HR. Give him a full healthy year and he's a 30 HR guy. You might also consider he's 25 and just now approaching the age at which power peaks. I thought you knew baseball?

Until he stays healthy enough to actually do it once, you cannot say he's a 30-HR guy. I thought you knew logic.

 

[gp956]

Until he stays healthy enough to actually do it once, you cannot say he's a 30-HR guy. I thought you knew logic.

I do. Now you're just being stupid. I guess Huff is a 30HR guy then, by your logic. So your original post is a fail from the get go. Nice. You might want to take some time off to think before you post next.

 

[CameronFrye]

I do. Now you're just being stupid. I guess Huff is a 30HR guy then, by your logic. So your original post is a fail from the get go. Nice. You might want to take some time off to think before you post next.

No. Sorry. You are stretching my words here. Huff is obviously on the down-side of his career. His swing is off and he has no power any longer.

You called Pablo Sandoval a 30-HR guy because over 141 games over two partial seasons, he hit 28 homers. Not only does that project a 162-game season that he has never played, but it also assumes that he will keep up that pace indefinitely.

Your logic breaks down because no player other than Barry Bonds is that consistent game in and game out over the course of a season. And Sandoval is not Barry Bonds.

My statement says that projections are bullshit. Period. Until I see a full-season stat line from Pablo Sandoval that has at least 30 home runs, you cannot call him a 30-HR guy.

You can say he has 30-home run power. I will not argue with that. But you cannot call him a 30-home run guy. Especially since that is a term that people apply to guys like Pujols, Ryan Braun, Mark Teixeira, etc - guys who have hit 30 HR in a season multiple times. Until Pablo does it once, he is not that guy. Until he does it TWICE, he really should not be that guy.

 

[gp956]

No. Sorry. You are stretching my words here. Huff is obviously on the down-side of his career. His swing is off and he has no power any longer.

You called Pablo Sandoval a 30-HR guy because over 141 games over two partial seasons, he hit 28 homers. Not only does that project a 162-game season that he has never played, but it also assumes that he will keep up that pace indefinitely.

Your logic breaks down because no player other than Barry Bonds is that consistent game in and game out over the course of a season. And Sandoval is not Barry Bonds.

My statement says that projections are bullshit. Period. Until I see a full-season stat line from Pablo Sandoval that has at least 30 home runs, you cannot call him a 30-HR guy.

You can say he has 30-home run power. I will not argue with that. But you cannot call him a 30-home run guy. Especially since that is a term that people apply to guys like Pujols, Ryan Braun, Mark Teixeira, etc - guys who have hit 30 HR in a season multiple times. Until Pablo does it once, he is not that guy. Until he does it TWICE, he really should not be that guy.

Dude........this is what you wrote: "My involvement in this whole line of discussion (this thread and the Soler thread) revolves around the fact that I believe the Giants need at least one bat that has 30 HR power. "

Jesus Fucking Christ.

 

[calsnowskier]

The Gs are avoiding the HS players like the plague this year. Very interesting.

Through 24 rounds, only 1 HS player taken. Going from years past, they would typically have a small handful of them by now (3-5)

 

[gp956]

The Gs are avoiding the HS players like the plague this year. Very interesting.

Through 24 rounds, only 1 HS player taken. Going from years past, they would typically have a small handful of them by now (3-5)

I don't know much about the new draft rules, but didn't Sabean say fewer high school players would be drafted because teams could not "afford" to buy out their college scholarships?

 

[gp956]

Here's some of Fla-Giant's thoughts via McC:

Of the 15 guys that the Giants drafted in the first 2 days, I'm only really excited about the long-term prospects of 5 of them (Stratton, Agosta, Johnson, McCall and Hollick). And 1 of the 5 that I'm excited about is the HS hitter (Shilo McCall) they drafted in the 9th round that I highly doubt the Giants will be able to sign unless they're willing to pay the new penalties for going over their overall cap limit. It's not as if I don't think that Williamson, Okert, Encinosa and Rojas are mere org-filler that the Giants took to save money. Those 4 guys do seem to have some good upside and promise for the future. However, and this is the main key to my disappointment in the draft, the number of high-upside and exciting guys that were still on the board when the Giants drafted the first 3 of those 4 prospects (Rojas in the 15th round wasn't disappointing) is what really sticks in my craw.

Why did the Giants pass up all those younger prospects with high upsides? Why did they seem so in love with not just college players, but older college players. They actually drafted a guy in the 12th round that was born in 1989! Why do something like that when any money that you save under the slot when signing draftees after the 10th round can't be used to allow you to sign a top 10 round draftee for more money? Look, I would be fine with the Giants drafting so many seeming org fillers in the first 10 rounds if I saw that it was part of their plan to take the money they saved when signing those guys and using it to pay some hard-to-sign and high-upside kid that they had drafted elsewhere in the first 10 rounds, but I don't see that strategy being played out by the Giants. The one and only guy that they drafted in the first 10 rounds that might fall under such a plan is the HS hitter, Shilo McCall. But, if they were so in love with him then why not just draft him 2 to 3 rounds sooner when his slot would have allowed them to pay him $150K to $180K without having to worry about paying any penalties?

 

[calsnowskier]

Yea. It looks like the new draft-slot rules are messing with the Giants pretty bad (I am only singling out the Giants because I have not focused on other teams). I understand the reason for the slotting. The MLB draft is a HUGE crapshoot, and the bonus' these guys have been getting recently is not good for the game. But is there a better solution?

Could these new rules end up "killing" the HS draftee, giving incentive to the kids going to college? If so, I think that is good on MANY levels (and bad on a few as well).

I think these rules will make the draft less-fun to watch for the next few years, unfortunately.

 

[gp956]

Yea. It looks like the new draft-slot rules are messing with the Giants pretty bad (I am only singling out the Giants because I have not focused on other teams). I understand the reason for the slotting. The MLB draft is a HUGE crapshoot, and the bonus' these guys have been getting recently is not good for the game. But is there a better solution?

Could these new rules end up "killing" the HS draftee, giving incentive to the kids going to college? If so, I think that is good on MANY levels (and bad on a few as well).

I think these rules will make the draft less-fun to watch for the next few years, unfortunately.

It's tough on a kid, when both the players union and the owners are willing to screw you. I think these new rules will have a chilling effect on a talented athlete choosing to play baseball. I'd expect teams to scour the winter leagues for players in the future.

 

[calsnowskier]

It's tough on a kid, when both the players union and the owners are willing to screw you. I think these new rules will have a chilling effect on a talented athlete choosing to play baseball. I'd expect teams to scour the winter leagues for players in the future.

I was not even thinking of the competition with other sports for the athletes themselves. That is a good point.

Ultimately, if this process improves college baseball, it may be a net gain, but if it pushes the Bo Jacksons, Deion Sanders', Samdjdhsgagkshfgjas, etc to football (or the Hershisers to hockey, etc), than it will be a HUGE net negative for the sport.

 

[gp956]

Article on Shilo McCall:

Shilo McCall will never play another game in the city of Farmington.

He plans to sign a contract with the San Francisco Giants after the organization drafted him in the ninth round of the 2012 MLB First Year Player Draft with the 298th overall pick. The 6-foot-1 210-pound center fielder is also committed to Arkansas, but he said his plans are to turn professional.

McCall said he expected to be drafted as high as the fifth round but negotiating with the Giants took a bit longer. "Things didn't work out in the fifth round. The number I wanted there was too high. They offered me more in the seventh round and I said it was too low. An hour later they offered a bit more and I said no to that, too," McCall said. "Then I figured I wasn't going to get drafted where I wanted and the money wouldn't be enough for me to go if I went later than the 10th round.

I almost threw in the towel. "I got in the shower and then my adviser called and said that my holding out had worked and they offered right around what I wanted. I said, 'Heck yeah, let's do it.'"

If this version is accurate, then the Giants will have to sign McCall over slot, which perhaps is the reason they took older players in a lot of the early rounds - they'll sign for slot or below.

 

[calsnowskier]

Article on Shilo McCall, with perhaps a biased view on the Giants tactics:



If this version is accurate, then the Giants will have to sign McCall over slot, which perhaps is the reason they took older players in a lot of the early rounds - they'll sign for slot or below.

Is McCall a big enough prospect to dedicate nearly their entire first 10 rounds to? Seems a stretch, but I am ignorant towards his abilities...