gruden's end of season presser

[Sharkinva]

I'm convinced Shark takes these positions just to argue. So if Kerrigan broke a wrist and missed 5 games he should be cut? Makes about as much sense as your defense of a DC who has not just been bad for his few years here he has been bad his entire coaching career.

Waiting for you to promote Rich Kotite as our next head coach. Dude got a raw deal right?

Notice I said any one who has missed a significant amount of games over the LAST 3-4 years. We are building forward right?? And i defend Haslett because I actually understand why he was brought here, and that wasnt to chase some magical top ten in yards given up spot. I also realize that he has never been given the tools needed to actually run his kind of defense. I invite you to look back at his teams performances in Sacks and turnovers from before he got to DC and you will realize that those were his calling cards. Its why he got the job.

And i will mention that every time some one says fuck it it cant get any worse, our front office usually finds a way to make it worse.

 

[j_y19]

What does Jim Zorn have to do with a new DC? Haz has been here for what 4 years? His defense has been terrible all around in each of those 4 years and especially bad at creating turnovers, the very reason he was brought in and the very reason they switched to the 3-4. After 4 years I would hardly call that a rash decision.

He has had his chance to show that he can elevate marginal talent. He has failed miserably. And again this is not his first rodeo, he has always had bad defenses. Saying he has had bad talent for every one of those 15 years takes excuse making to another level.

Zorn is an example of how it can be worse when all you can get is the bottom of the barrel talent. If you remember, no one else wanted the job.
As for everything you state about Haslett, I agree. But it still doesn't mean it can't get worse.

 

[skinsdad62]

i wont buy that in 18 years haslett never got his players to run his defense sorry but his career speaks for itself

mediocre defenses throughout

i dont see anymore upside to him . time for new blood

 

[SoCalWizFan]

Lol. Things have gotten so bad that now a lot of fans advocate keeping a coach primarily because his successor "could be worse". That is a true losers philosophy.

Give me a break. This team just went 7-25 over the past two seasons & played dreadful defense in the majority of those games. Sure the talent could have been better. However - the coaching was certainly not stellar & there is very little signs of player development on the defense.

Have we reached the pt as fans where we simply "don't want to see things get worse"? Pathetic.

 

[Sharkinva]

i wont buy that in 18 years haslett never got his players to run his defense sorry but his career speaks for itself

mediocre defenses throughout

i dont see anymore upside to him . time for new blood

Again it depends on what your defense was built to do and what exactly you stressed. Are you going to deny that aside from his time in DC, Hasletts defenses have generally ranked high in Sacks and turn overs?? Thats what his defenses have always been good for (provided he has the personnel).

I get it, you all want your pound of flesh for yet another bad year. And in this case you figure ANY one would be better. But how many times has that line of thinking bitten us in the ass??

I will say this, for the five years he has been in DC he has never had a complete defense to actually run his system. We have always had either poor safety play, No pass rush to speak of, or both. Combined with the worst special teams units in the league. But you are right, he should be fired.. .and next year when we are again looking at a sub par defense, and another losing season do we then fire yet another head coach??

And i will point out that alot of the same people wanted him gone after year one.

 

[j_y19]

Lol. Things have gotten so bad that now a lot of fans advocate keeping a coach primarily because his successor "could be worse". That is a true losers philosophy.

Give me a break. This team just went 7-25 over the past two seasons & played dreadful defense in the majority of those games. Sure the talent could have been better. However - the coaching was certainly not stellar & there is very little signs of player development on the defense.

Have we reached the pt as fans where we simply "don't want to see things get worse"? Pathetic.

You're right, that is pathetic. Let me clarify, or re-inforce, what I originally stated. I would love to see us replace Haslett. I just hope the organization does true due diligence and doesn't just knee jerk fire and hire, as many on here are proposing. I have said all along that we need a better DC. I'm just not convinced that we are going to find that candidate this year.

So I'll as the question again.....What DC candidate that is worth anything be willing to risk their career and come here at this point? Imagine yourself in a position in your job. You have an opportunity to go to another company for a big raise. The downside is that it is highly likely you are going to fail because the company is just fucked up and your boss may be fired within the next year and if he goes, you are probably done also. Would you take that job or stay where you are for a period (where you are well respected and successful) until something more attractive presents itself?

 

[SoCalWizFan]

You're right, that is pathetic. Let me clarify, or re-inforce, what I originally stated. I would love to see us replace Haslett. I just hope the organization does true due diligence and doesn't just knee jerk fire and hire, as many on here are proposing. I have said all along that we need a better DC. I'm just not convinced that we are going to find that candidate this year.

So I'll as the question again.....What DC candidate that is worth anything be willing to risk their career and come here at this point? Imagine yourself in a position in your job. You have an opportunity to go to another company for a big raise. The downside is that it is highly likely you are going to fail because the company is just fucked up and your boss may be fired within the next year and if he goes, you are probably done also. Would you take that job or stay where you are for a period (where you are well respected and successful) until something more attractive presents itself?

OK - well stated. This is probably where the organization needs to fix their infrastructure to ensure that they find a better way of selecting coaches (e.g. find someone else to help select coaches
& stop selecting your buddies). If there were signs that this team was possibly looking to go in another direction then you may be surprised at who would sign on. Remember the flip side is that anyone who turns this defense and/or team around will look like a genius.

Also - don't always assume that nobody will take these jobs because of the reputation of this organization. Remember - Marty signed on as the Skins head coach literally months after he ripped Snyder on the air.

 

[j_y19]

OK - well stated. This is probably where the organization needs to fix their infrastructure to ensure that they find a better way of selecting coaches (e.g. find someone else to help select coaches
& stop selecting your buddies). If there were signs that this team was possibly looking to go in another direction then you may be surprised at who would sign on. Remember the flip side is that anyone who turns this defense and/or team around will look like a genius.

Also - don't always assume that nobody will take these jobs because of the reputation of this organization. Remember - Marty signed on as the Skins head coach literally months after he ripped Snyder on the air.

I think there was a time when coaches would take a chance here, but this has proven to be a place where coaching careers go to die. Think back on all of the coaches we have had here that either never coached again or had to take serious demotions to stay employed. Its my concern that its gotten to the point that potential candidates that have other options will need too SEE change, not just talk of it. This is why I think its very possible that Haslett lasts one more year. We just won't be able to find any that has other options this year. All we will find are retreads and those that aren't ready or capable. This could make it worse. First and foremost, do no more harm.

 

[Sharkinva]

Simple question for those who say we cant do any worse than Haslett.


If you were a young up and coming coach, would you take this job knowing how many well established and respected coaches flamed out in DC??

If you were a Rex Ryan or a Wade Phillips, seeing how this team were run, would you take this particular job??

Yes there is a very good chance Haslett gets fired. But odds are his replacement will either be a burnt out retread trying to rekindle his name (Wade, Rex) or some semi young assistant that will likely be in way over his head in any case.

I will say it again, we fired the wrong coaches for the wrong reason last year. Now firing Haslett would simply compound on that mistake and stands a real good chance of making things worse instead of better. We need to fix at least one side of the ball and special teams at this point. As i dont see them giving up on RG3, they need to fix the offensive side of the ball and special teams. Trying to fix all three right now, will likely mean we fix nothing.

 

[skinsdad62]

Again it depends on what your defense was built to do and what exactly you stressed. Are you going to deny that aside from his time in DC, Hasletts defenses have generally ranked high in Sacks and turn overs?? Thats what his defenses have always been good for (provided he has the personnel).

I get it, you all want your pound of flesh for yet another bad year. And in this case you figure ANY one would be better. But how many times has that line of thinking bitten us in the ass??

I will say this, for the five years he has been in DC he has never had a complete defense to actually run his system. We have always had either poor safety play, No pass rush to speak of, or both. Combined with the worst special teams units in the league. But you are right, he should be fired.. .and next year when we are again looking at a sub par defense, and another losing season do we then fire yet another head coach??

And i will point out that alot of the same people wanted him gone after year one.

18 years of mediocre defensive football and until i see turnover stats i say hogwash

plain and simple enough excuses , last season he was hand cuffed , this season injuries the season before sunspots the year before that el nino the season before that 1st year in the defense

enough he isnt getting it done

 

[SoCalWizFan]

Simple question for those who say we cant do any worse than Haslett.


If you were a young up and coming coach, would you take this job knowing how many well established and respected coaches flamed out in DC??

If you were a Rex Ryan or a Wade Phillips, seeing how this team were run, would you take this particular job??

Yes there is a very good chance Haslett gets fired. But odds are his replacement will either be a burnt out retread trying to rekindle his name (Wade, Rex) or some semi young assistant that will likely be in way over his head in any case.

I will say it again, we fired the wrong coaches for the wrong reason last year. Now firing Haslett would simply compound on that mistake and stands a real good chance of making things worse instead of better. We need to fix at least one side of the ball and special teams at this point. As i dont see them giving up on RG3, they need to fix the offensive side of the ball and special teams. Trying to fix all three right now, will likely mean we fix nothing.

Who was wrongly fired last year? Perhaps Kyle Shanahan, but that was probably since he was a package deal with his dad. I certainly don't believe that Mike Shanahan was wrongly fired. In spite of whatever happened this season I believe that they made the correct call in getting rid of that guy.

Again - I am not maintaining that a successor cannot do worse. However - if your primary goal is to simply "not do worse" than you already have the mindset of a loser. Look at this another way - if Haslett is fired do you believe that a large amt of teams will come running to him with offers to be their next D coordinator?

 

[SoCalWizFan]

I am almost starting to wonder if some Redskins fans would not prefer having this terrible coach here next season simply due to the fact that some folks would rather bitch about the Redskins non-stop rather than see this team ultimately succeed.

 

[Sharkinva]

Who was wrongly fired last year? Perhaps Kyle Shanahan, but that was probably since he was a package deal with his dad. I certainly don't believe that Mike Shanahan was wrongly fired. In spite of whatever happened this season I believe that they made the correct call in getting rid of that guy.

Again - I am not maintaining that a successor cannot do worse. However - if your primary goal is to simply "not do worse" than you already have the mindset of a loser. Look at this another way - if Haslett is fired do you believe that a large amt of teams will come running to him with offers to be their next D coordinator?

Mike was fired for one main reason... RG3.

And the goal is to get better. I simply dont see as to where a coaching change accomplishes that for our defense at the moment. We actually need PLAYERS. You know guys that are actually on the field and can actually stay healthy. And I simply dont see a BETTER option at coach because as has been stated... we will either pick up a retread, or a young guy way in over his head.

But to flip your question, if they fired Haslett right this second, name me two good DC candidates who you think would be beating down the door to take this job??

 

[skinsdad62]

Mike was fired for one main reason... RG3.

And the goal is to get better. I simply dont see as to where a coaching change accomplishes that for our defense at the moment. We actually need PLAYERS. You know guys that are actually on the field and can actually stay healthy. And I simply dont see a BETTER option at coach because as has been stated... we will either pick up a retread, or a young guy way in over his head.

But to flip your question, if they fired Haslett right this second, name me two good DC candidates who you think would be beating down the door to take this job??

fangio , thurman and gray are 3

 

[Sharkinva]

fangio , thurman and gray are 3

Now give me one solid reason why any of those three would even consider coming to the coaching execution chamber??

 

[j_y19]

fangio , thurman and gray are 3

Sorry, Dad, but there is no way those guys are beating down our door to be our next DC. They may have their pick of 7 or 8 DC positions on teams that are prepared to succeed. This is a losing franchise with a broken organization that still hasn't done the right things to begin to retool. Oh yeah, they would be working for a HC that is on thin ice and may himself be over his head and employed by an owner that has shown he has no reservations about screwing coaches over.

 

[skinsdad62]

well then we will find a damn one then but 7-25 wont cut it

 

[j_y19]

well then we will find a damn one then but 7-25 wont cut it

On this, we agree. I just think we are going to have to fix the franchise first (and prove it, not just talk about it) before attracting competent coaches to come here anymore. Hell, we reduced a potential HOF coach to a babbling idiot by the end of last year because this environment is so caustic. Don't think that doesn't go unnoticed by the coaching community (of which Shanahan has respect with many of his peers).

 

[Sharkinva]

Yep... no knee jerk pound of flesh i just want him gone there.

Fuck it fire him... some one will take the job.

 

[j_y19]

Yep... no knee jerk pound of flesh i just want him gone there.

Fuck it fire him... some one will take the job.

I have a son in law that is unemployed. He likes football and he is real smart and everyone likes him. Maybe he can do it. Hell, that's how our current OC got the job. How's that working out?