Early 25-man Roster

[Isaiah4110]

So in light of all the A's recent moves, realizing the A's off season is far from over, I thought it would be interesting to take a look at how the A's 25-man roster is shaping up thus far. I'll list platoon starters vs. righties and the "starter" with the starter vs. lefties showing up on the bench. Here's what I'm coming up with:

SP:
Kazmir
Parker
Gray
Griffin
Straily

RP:
CL Johnson
SU Cook
SU Doolittle
SU Gregerson
MR Otero
MR Scribner/Abad
LR Chavez/Lindblom

IF:
C Vogt
1B Moss
2B Sogard
3B Donaldson
SS Lowrie
DH/C Jaso

OF:
CF Crisp
LF Cespedes
RF Reddick

Bench:
C Norris
1B Freiman/Barton
2B/UTIL Callaspo/Punto
OF Gentry


A couple notes:

1. I'm not sure that I see how the roster could have room for both Alberto Callaspo and Nick Punto. Neither of them has real 1B experience to speak of (meaning you need a Freiman/Barton-type guy on the roster to back up Moss) and I can't see them running with a Jaso/Norris platoon given Jaso's concussion struggles. I guess they could also run with only 6 relievers, but that would leave them with a pretty short bullpen.
2. I realize a lot of guys are way down on Barton and I'm probably going to get flak for even sticking his name there, but I could see the A's deciding they liked what they saw from Freiman last year and sending him down to Sac to get full-time ABs and develop his power in a low-pressure situation. Under this scenario you would need Barton as your backup 1B.
3. Milone and Drew Pomeranz are likely going to compete with Straily and/or Griffin for the 5th and/or 4th rotation spots. I suppose there is also an outside chance Fernando Rodriguez could make an appearance here, but that all depends on how well he has recuperated from TJ surgery.
4. I like the trade off from last year switching Smith/Young out for Gentry as your primary 4th OF. Gentry can play all 3 positions with great defense and may even be OK to step in for Crisp at lead-off when he needs a day off.
5. The only potential "weakness" I see here is that the lineup is lacking what has become the prototypical DH (.280 avg, 35 HR guy) and will instead be continuing to use that slot as a "half rest" day for some of their everyday position players. Theoretically (dream world) I suppose Moss could become that guy if Barton tears the cover off the ball in spring training.

That's about it. I don't see any "glaring" holes that tell mean Beane is absolutely not done yet, though there are still moves that could be made.

 

[averagewins]

For starters, there is no way Pomeranz isn't making the starting rotation unless he implodes in spring training. There is also no way Milone isn't in the pen as long relief unless there is a trade. There is no way lousy Sogard is the second baseman. Vogt is also not a starting catcher. Norris is a lot better than Vogt.

I still think Beane will package Sogard, Straily and potentially a reliever for an upgrade at second or in the outfield. I'm not sold on Reddick at all.

 

[RaiderZar]

For starters, there is no way Pomeranz isn't making the starting rotation unless he implodes in spring training. There is also no way Milone isn't in the pen as long relief unless there is a trade. There is no way lousy Sogard is the second baseman. Vogt is also not a starting catcher. Norris is a lot better than Vogt.

I still think Beane will package Sogard, Straily and potentially a reliever for an upgrade at second or in the outfield. I'm not sold on Reddick at all.

Can't disagree with much here. Either Straily or Milone are gone, maybe both. Get Willingham back as DH. If Philly fails again, get Rollins at SS & move Lowrie to 2nd. I'm going to bet BB is done for now.

 

[Isaiah4110]

For starters, there is no way Pomeranz isn't making the starting rotation unless he implodes in spring training. There is also no way Milone isn't in the pen as long relief unless there is a trade. There is no way lousy Sogard is the second baseman. Vogt is also not a starting catcher. Norris is a lot better than Vogt.

I still think Beane will package Sogard, Straily and potentially a reliever for an upgrade at second or in the outfield. I'm not sold on Reddick at all.

1. Pomeranz is a 25 year old career 4-14 pitcher with a 5.20 ERA and 1.54 WHIP. He has shown that he is both very hittable (.269 career BAA) and lacks control (4.6 BB per 9 IP). He also averages less than 4.5 innings per start. He is FAR from being a shoe-in to open the season in the starting rotation.
2. Milone may or may not be considered bullpen material. Quite an outlandish statement you make there. Last year the A's brass showed they would rather have Milone starting in Sacramento than pitching out of the bullpen in Oakland if he was struggling to find success in the A's rotation.
3. The A's have shown they are completely content running with a platoon at more than one position, and second base is absolutely one of those positions. Last year Sogard provided serviceable defense and an OPS of nearly .700 against RHP. I see no reason to think that, given the current makeup of the A's roster, the A's would not be doing the exact same thing if the season started today.
4. Again, the A's have no problem with platooning players at catcher. Norris had a .445 OPS (yes, that's on-base plus slugging) against righties last year. In roughly the same number of at bats against righties Vogt produced a .698 OPS. If the season started right now I see no reason to believe the A's wouldn't be running a platoon at catcher again.
5. Have you see trade rumors somewhere? who is going to trade a full-time starting second baseman (who is also an upgrade over the A's current platoon option) for Sogard, Straily and a reliever? Unless you are thinking Beane is trading away one of our top 4 relievers (Cook, Johnson, Doolittle, and Gregerson) then Straily is the best (most complete/valuable) player in the package, and he isn't going to get you a Brandon Phillips/Ian Kinsler/Chase Utley/Robinson Cano type player.

In a nutshell: Please support your outlandish claims with links, quotes (sourced) and logical facts.

 

[Isaiah4110]

Can't disagree with much here. Either Straily or Milone are gone, maybe both. Get Willingham back as DH. If Philly fails again, get Rollins at SS & move Lowrie to 2nd. I'm going to bet BB is done for now.

1. Straily and.or Milone gone? Where? For what in return? What makes you so sure?
2. Willingham is set to make $7 million next season for the Twins. His batting average last season was a mere .208 and his OPS .709. A) Why would we want him? B) How would we get him?
3. If Philly fails again when? This next season? So are you saying to get Rollins for the 2015 roster in a thread about how the 2014 roster is shaping up, or is there something I'm missing? Additionally, Rollins is due to make $11 million each year this year and next. That's a bit pricey for an aging (and a little overrated due to his recent decline) SS whose best feature was his speed.

 

[RaiderZar]

1. Straily and.or Milone gone? Where? For what in return? What makes you so sure?
2. Willingham is set to make $7 million next season for the Twins. His batting average last season was a mere .208 and his OPS .709. A) Why would we want him? B) How would we get him?
3. If Philly fails again when? This next season? So are you saying to get Rollins for the 2015 roster in a thread about how the 2014 roster is shaping up, or is there something I'm missing? Additionally, Rollins is due to make $11 million each year this year and next. That's a bit pricey for an aging (and a little overrated due to his recent decline) SS whose best feature was his speed.

As I said, BB is probably done for now. All of my SUGGESTIONS were for trade deadline deals.

 

[Isaiah4110]

As I said, BB is probably done for now. All of my SUGGESTIONS were for trade deadline deals.

Which would then obviously depend on how the season is panning out. That makes a heck of a lot more sense. Should have said that to begin with

 

[RaiderZar]

Which would then obviously depend on how the season is panning out. That makes a heck of a lot more sense. Should have said that to begin with

Thanks for the Any chance Nagatakeshima (or whatever his name is) pans out at SS, so Lowrie can move to 2nd? Is S. Drew to expensive to add back at SS? I still think the roster needs a defensive upgrade at SS, which would automatically get a better bat at 2nd. Also, need a DH threat from the right side. I like the Green Giant at 1B, but his bat is pretty weak. Maybe, with a year under his belt, he'll step it up. We still have the same gaps that cost us in the PO's.

 

[averagewins]

Quoting stats on Pomeranz is beyond stupid. He played in Coors. Not to mention it sounds like you've haven't watched the A's in a decade. Every time they bring pitchers here they pitch 10 times better. Kazmir and Pomeranz will most likely pitch great here. The A's have fabulous pitching coaches and the pitchers pitch in a great park.

 

[DonyellFreak]

I don't see Melvin wanting two left hand hitting first baseman the way he likes to platoon so unless Moss is moving into the outfield I'd expect Freiman or Callaspo to be playing at first against LHP, BoMel said at the winter meetings Albeto will get some time there. I cannot stand Barton and hope we DFA him a third time coming out of the spring but who knows he might " win " the job the way Beane loves that guy.

I think Pomeranz could take over Blevins spot in the bullpen but he'll need a good spring, I won't be shocked if Beane makes another move or two before spring training kicks off the year we got Balfour he was a late signing along with Brian Fuentes. Beane might see value in some older players that no one else wants to kick the tires on again this year.

 

[Isaiah4110]

Thanks for the Any chance Nagatakeshima (or whatever his name is) pans out at SS, so Lowrie can move to 2nd? Is S. Drew to expensive to add back at SS? I still think the roster needs a defensive upgrade at SS, which would automatically get a better bat at 2nd. Also, need a DH threat from the right side. I like the Green Giant at 1B, but his bat is pretty weak. Maybe, with a year under his belt, he'll step it up. We still have the same gaps that cost us in the PO's.

Yeah, I've been wondering about Hiroyuki Nakajima myself. I haven't heard anything about him in quite some time and he isn't listed on the A's 40-man roster (because he was DFA'ed/outrighted to Sacramento on August 16th). I'm not sure what that means for this year, except that I believe his contract was for 2 years, so even if he spends all year in the minors again I don't think he can decide he isn't happy here and return to Japan. His numbers last season were uninspiring (.283 AVG and .698 OPS in Sacramento look ok on the surface but he added zero power and zero steals while striking out 83 times and only walking 23 times). I'm not sure whether he has adapted yet to playing defense on grass/dirt as opposed to the turf used in Japanese fields.

In a nutshell I would love to see Nakajima pan out this year and slide Lowrie over to SS, but looking strictly at his stats in AAA last season I don't think it's likely. I would be extremely surprised, however, if he didn't get an invite to the Major League camp in Spring Training and the opportunity to prove himself there.

Stephen Drew's agent is Scott Boras, which makes me want to run the stereotype on Boras clients and say he is going to be out of our price range. When asked if Drew would return to the Red Sox, this was Boras response: "That’s not a decision Stephen has made yet," Boras said. "We have to look at the totality of what’s available to him. Some of the offers are -- the positions teams are taking -- are somewhat contingent on another move. To have a full slate of what’s available to him is not yet something that is ripe." Make of that what you will. I'm not sure where the A's stand on total salary left available to work with right now, but I'm sure that will come into play. I would love the idea of an every day SS sliding Lowrie over the become the every day 2B though.

Every-day DH would also be a nice addition, but I'm not sure that is on Beane's priority list. Due to recent history, he seems to be content allowing the DH role to be used as a rotational position to help keep our guys fresh and healthy.

 

[Isaiah4110]

Quoting stats on Pomeranz is beyond stupid. He played in Coors. Not to mention it sounds like you've haven't watched the A's in a decade. Every time they bring pitchers here they pitch 10 times better. Kazmir and Pomeranz will most likely pitch great here. The A's have fabulous pitching coaches and the pitchers pitch in a great park.

Ummm... Did you bother to look at the splits? Pomeranz is actually worse (notably worse) away from Coors than he has been at Coors. Both are quite poor stat lines. He is still only 25, so there is plenty of time for development (and the A's DO have a superb history of developing pitchers), but he is still FAR from a lock to open the season in the starting rotation. I'm not saying it is guaranteed to not happen, simply that I think, given the information available at this moment, that it is unlikely. He will have to beat out some guys in Spring Training to make it happen.

 

[Isaiah4110]

Quoting stats on Pomeranz is beyond stupid. He played in Coors. Not to mention it sounds like you've haven't watched the A's in a decade. Every time they bring pitchers here they pitch 10 times better. Kazmir and Pomeranz will most likely pitch great here. The A's have fabulous pitching coaches and the pitchers pitch in a great park.

Ummm... Quoting stats for Pomeranz is actually quite intelligent. His league/park adjusted career ERA is 89. Last season it was 72. Average is 100. So... he has been considerably below average over the course of his career. Did you bother to look at the splits? Pomeranz is actually worse (notably worse) away from Coors than he has been at Coors. Both are quite poor stat lines.

Additionally, Pomeranz may be moving from Coors to Oakland, but he is also moving from the NL to the AL. Remove the opposing pitcher from his career stats and yes, they get worse again. THink I'm making this all up? Think again: Drew Pomeranz Career Pitching Splits - Baseball-Reference.com

He is still only 25, so there is plenty of time for development (and the A's DO have a superb history of developing pitchers), but he is still FAR from a lock to open the season in the starting rotation. I'm not saying it is guaranteed to not happen, simply that I think, given the information available at this moment, that it is unlikely. He will have to beat out some guys in Spring Training to make it happen.

 

[Isaiah4110]

I don't see Melvin wanting two left hand hitting first baseman the way he likes to platoon so unless Moss is moving into the outfield I'd expect Freiman or Callaspo to be playing at first against LHP, BoMel said at the winter meetings Albeto will get some time there. I cannot stand Barton and hope we DFA him a third time coming out of the spring but who knows he might " win " the job the way Beane loves that guy.

I think Pomeranz could take over Blevins spot in the bullpen but he'll need a good spring, I won't be shocked if Beane makes another move or two before spring training kicks off the year we got Balfour he was a late signing along with Brian Fuentes. Beane might see value in some older players that no one else wants to kick the tires on again this year.

In order for Barton to make the opening day roster (without someone being injured) it would have to be the "perfect storm" in Spring Training. I see three major things that would need to happen:

1. The A's would have to want Freiman to start the season in AAA to get full time ABs and develop into an every day 1B. This does two things: opens a spot on the major league roster and fills the 1B slot in Sacramento.
2. Barton would have to tear the cover off the ball in Spring Training (.400+ average, moderate power, and look great at the plate).
3. The A's would have to be comfortable using Moss as an everyday DH. This might necessitate some other roster moves.

All that adds up to it pretty much being a pipe dream, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't be happy if it happened.

I'm a little partial towards Barton. I'm pulling for him and want to see him succeed. That doesn't mean I want him starting for us regardless of performance; but rather that I want him to get back to that potential he flashed for us and be good enough to be a starter again. I don't want to see him "win" anything without first earning it, and I really don't think any of the A's brass does either. I'm also pretty confident that (given the posts I've seen from you thus far DonyellFreak) you wouldn't be taking the same stance if Barton were hitting .280/.390/.420 in the majors with 15+ HRs in a season. Basically what I'm trying to make clear is that I'm not a blind Barton supporter who wants to see him starting if he is going to hit .220 with an OPS under .700. I just want him to become a successful player again.

 

[averagewins]

A's fans are the absolute kings of quoting stupid, worthless stats. WAR is a big one for A's fan and is basically, the dumbest stat in all of sports.

 

[Isaiah4110]

What's your point? Is someone quoting WAR here? How about ANY "worthless" stat for that matter?

Seeing as you are claiming to be an A's fan I supposed you are also insulting yourself here?

 

[gregrey972]

A's fans are the absolute kings of quoting stupid, worthless stats. WAR is a big one for A's fan and is basically, the dumbest stat in all of sports.

I believe you have a troll on your hands A's fans!

 

[Isaiah4110]

From an article on the A's site:

Because of their depth in this area, the A's are unlikely to consider any of their leftover starters for a bullpen spot. This means Tommy Milone, Josh Lindblom and Drew Pomeranz are likely to be stretched out and begin the season at Triple-A Sacramento, barring injury this spring to Oakland's expected five starters: Jarrod Parker, Sonny Gray, Scott Kazmir, A.J. Griffin and Dan Straily.

Interesting. Looks like Straily has the definitely inside track on the 5th starter spot. This gives us INCREDIBLE depth in the starting rotation as Milone, Lindblom and Pomeranz would all be likely candidates to sit in the 4 or 5 slots on most other teams' rotations.

 

[Isaiah4110]

Another interesting note: It appears the A's will be carrying only 2 catchers, with Stephen Vogt the odd man out, and including Daric Barton on the opening day roster. The article I read says Brandon Moss is expected to get the majority of the starts at DH against right handed pitchers with Barton starting at first. Jaso will then platoon with Norris behind the plate.

I'm wondering why the sudden change here. My guess is Callaspo was not working out at first and Barton had a very good spring.