You know you are in a league from hell when

[tlance]

I guess i'm just not one who goes by previous years stats. Brees isn't young anymore and is bound to get hurt or start slowing down at some point and if Cam throws 30 his value is just as good as Brees who throws 40 and there is less downside because hes not a little old man playing QB.

Not talking about last year's stats, or even this year's projections.

I am simply countering your point where you said Cam might be the #2 QB in a league with 6 point passing TDs.

The exact opposite of that is true. He is more valuable relative to other QBs in leagues where passing TDs are worth fewer points because Cam will still get 6 for the ones that he runs in. Give me a pocket passer all day in a 6 point passing TD league.

 

[averagejoe]

You know you are in a league from hell when...

I can say that I haven't been in a league that was "hellish." But I have been involved in a few "hellish" drafts:

1) One year exactly half - count 'em, 6 owners - missed our draft and had to autopick.
2) In another league, there was a verbal argument before a live draft began, resulting in one of the arguing owners leaving (which actually was good because the 11th owner never showed). Down to 10 teams.
3) During a live auction draft, one guy was running late and sent his wife with the instructions "get me as many 49ers as you can." It was funny - yet sad.
4) A girl in one league drafted players based on how attractive they were. Before you chuckle, her team was actually competitive.

And then there's this:

5) The year Peyton Manning missed because of his neck, one guy was running late, so autopick selected 5 - yes five - Colts players.

 

[SmokingMonkey]

I can say that I haven't been in a league that was "hellish." But I have been involved in a few "hellish" drafts:

1) One year exactly half - count 'em, 6 owners - missed our draft and had to autopick.
2) In another league, there was a verbal argument before a live draft began, resulting in one of the arguing owners leaving (which actually was good because the 11th owner never showed). Down to 10 teams.
3) During a live auction draft, one guy was running late and sent his wife with the instructions "get me as many 49ers as you can." It was funny - yet sad.
4) A girl in one league drafted players based on how attractive they were. Before you chuckle, her team was actually competitive.

And then there's this:

5) The year Peyton Manning missed because of his neck, one guy was running late, so autopick selected 5 - yes five - Colts players.

HAHAHAHAHA. Now that is unfortunate. If Peyton was healthy, that actually might have worked!

One of the worst experiences I've ever had was the first time playing with a female in the league. This sleaze ball dbag (who I hated 2-3 seasons prior to the girl joining us) waited a bit too long to draft a QB and ended up with garbage. I can't remember if we still had 12 that year or if we were down to 10 owners, but you only started 1 QB, but you HAD to roster 2 at all times throughout the year. Anyway, the girl drafts Brees and has BigBen as her backup. DBag owner convinces her that she doesn't need BigBen, and that it was more important for her to get more WR depth (which is way easier in season off waivers than finding a decent QB with that format). Trades her Ocho Stinko for BigBen, the year Ocho was with the Pats.

16rec, 270yds, 1TD......she only started him 1 time, and no, it was not the time he scored.
BigBen didn't light the world on fire that season, but was still an outright fleecing.
Next season, the company that ran the league (I was the only non-employee or non-retiree from that company) hit the skids and laid off most of the guys that were in the league. It was about half worker bees and half upper mgmt. Needless to say, they didn't even attempt to start it the following year.

 

[TREFF]

HAHAHAHAHA. Now that is unfortunate. If Peyton was healthy, that actually might have worked!

One of the worst experiences I've ever had was the first time playing with a female in the league. This sleaze ball dbag (who I hated 2-3 seasons prior to the girl joining us) waited a bit too long to draft a QB and ended up with garbage. I can't remember if we still had 12 that year or if we were down to 10 owners, but you only started 1 QB, but you HAD to roster 2 at all times throughout the year. Anyway, the girl drafts Brees and has BigBen as her backup. DBag owner convinces her that she doesn't need BigBen, and that it was more important for her to get more WR depth (which is way easier in season off waivers than finding a decent QB with that format). Trades her Ocho Stinko for BigBen, the year Ocho was with the Pats.

16rec, 270yds, 1TD......she only started him 1 time, and no, it was not the time he scored.
BigBen didn't light the world on fire that season, but was still an outright fleecing.
Next season, the company that ran the league (I was the only non-employee or non-retiree from that company) hit the skids and laid off most of the guys that were in the league. It was about half worker bees and half upper mgmt. Needless to say, they didn't even attempt to start it the following year.

Lol

Monkey... that WAS Joes first MBBRL team. . And he was actually quite competitive. .I came in dead last that year (no b league existed, this no regulation )

 

[Beengay fudgepackers]

Last year I was in a draft I decided to do as practice for my money leagues, and the first round went like this...

1. AP
2. Lynch
3. Brees
4. Rodgers
5. Manning
6. Foster
7. Seahawks D
8. Rice
9. Calvin
10. Brady

After the first round I realized these people sucked at drafting. 4 of the people were from my money league and the 6 others were from a gaming clan of some video game. Needless to say, I learned nothing.

 

[Barilko]

well simply put i have no prob with Peyton being the first Qb off of the board but 1st pick overall....No... Jeesh if one of the boys promises to pick Peyton at 1 then ill trade my 1st pick

 

[Nosferatu]

Not talking about last year's stats, or even this year's projections.

I am simply countering your point where you said Cam might be the #2 QB in a league with 6 point passing TDs.

The exact opposite of that is true. He is more valuable relative to other QBs in leagues where passing TDs are worth fewer points because Cam will still get 6 for the ones that he runs in. Give me a pocket passer all day in a 6 point passing TD league.

Isn't it awesome we all have an opinion. Fact is I stated he could be #2 because of his ability to run it in and if he throws 30 and runs in 10 he is just as valuable if not more so than someone like Brees because unlike Brees hes not a 6'0 200 pound 35 year old...

I also don't believe I said Cam would be #2 because of 6 points for a TD pass, what I said was if you are awarded 6 pts for a TD pass those picks wouldnt be crazy.

 

[tlance]

Depends on the scoring... I don't think either are crazy picks if you get 6 pts for a TD pass and who knows Cam could blow up and throw for 30 and run in 10. Who are the QB's you think should be picked ahead of him? Brees and Rodgers and???

This is what you said.

Regardless of what you meant by it, the bolded statement implies that you don't think it is crazy to value Cam as the 2nd QB if you get 6 points for a TD pass. That is all.

I have seen some "experts" rank Cam outside of the top 12 this year. I think that is equally crazy as ranking him 2nd. The ankle injury could mean less running, and he simply is not as good a pocket passer as the top 3 options. Cam is somewhere between 4 and 10 in my book, but again, that is not the point I was countering.

 

[Nosferatu]

This is what you said.

Regardless of what you meant by it, the bolded statement implies that you don't think it is crazy to value Cam as the 2nd QB if you get 6 points for a TD pass. That is all.

I have seen some "experts" rank Cam outside of the top 12 this year. I think that is equally crazy as ranking him 2nd. The ankle injury could mean less running, and he simply is not as good a pocket passer as the top 3 options. Cam is somewhere between 4 and 10 in my book, but again, that is not the point I was countering.

Maybe if you understood what I was saying instead of just assuming what I meant this could have been avoided.

If passing TD's are 6 points it doesn't seem crazy to me for QB's to go 1 & 2. Regardless of your opinion Cam could just as easily finish 2nd in QB scoring as he could 4th - 10th. In such a scoring system RB isn't the obvious choice. Which was the original point.

Oh and I can't imagine caring less what some "experts" think or say. I have been playing fantasy football for 19 years and have formed my own opinions and have done quite well...

 

[tlance]

Peyton Manning is the first player drafted overall.
Cam Newton is the 2nd QB drafted.

He said Cam was the 2nd QB drafted, not the 2nd player. I am not the one misreading quotes and making assumptions here.

 

[tlance]

Maybe if you understood what I was saying instead of just assuming what I meant this could have been avoided.

If passing TD's are 6 points it doesn't seem crazy to me for QB's to go 1 & 2. Regardless of your opinion Cam could just as easily finish 2nd in QB scoring as he could 4th - 10th. In such a scoring system RB isn't the obvious choice. Which was the original point.

Oh and I can't imagine caring less what some "experts" think or say. I have been playing fantasy football for 19 years and have formed my own opinions and have done quite well...

Also, regardless of what Cam produces this year, taking him 2nd overall would not be a good move because ADP says you can get him at least 2 rounds later. You don't pass on a stud RB to draft a player who will likely be available in round 4 if you want to do well.

The only format where Cam (or any QB after the top 3) should even be considered in the first round is 2 QB leagues.

 

[Nosferatu]

He said Cam was the 2nd QB drafted, not the 2nd player. I am not the one misreading quotes and making assumptions here.

Ooops... Apologies...

Doesn't matter I still don't think it's a horrible pick. Probably a homer pick but as I said before I don't play let's look at last years numbers to determine this years rankings. Like I said Drew Brees is 35 and a tad on the small side and has avoided a serious injury but when does he start to slow down?

 

[Nosferatu]

Also, regardless of what Cam produces this year, taking him 2nd overall would not be a good move because ADP says you can get him at least 2 rounds later. You don't pass on a stud RB to draft a player who will likely be available in round 4 if you want to do well.

The only format where Cam (or any QB after the top 3) should even be considered in the first round is 2 QB leagues.

Taking him second overall in a 6 pt per TD pass league would not be a horrible move. Is it one i'd make? Probably not but it's not horrible...

ADP also means nothing to me, I might look at it but in no way do I use that as a guide. People are morons, I was in a league last year where a guy drafted a kicker in the 5th round. I was in a league last year where a guy took Willis McGahee in the 3rd. Not everyone playing fantasy football knows what the heck they are doing.

 

[TKOSpikes]

19 years experience should teach you about "value" and "reaching" though. And leaving Brees on the board while selecting Cam is terrible...no matter what you think will happen. Calling a Brees injury is unwise strategy. Taking Brees ahead of everyone but Peyton has nothing to do with last year's numbers...take a look at Brees' consistency, there aren't many like him.

 

[TKOSpikes]

Saying if Cam throws 30 and runs n 10 more, and if Brees gets hurt are two stretches.

 

[TKOSpikes]

And I'm glad to say I am not in, never was the in, nor will I ever be in a league with owners like that.... especially the kicker in 5th...just stupid...why bother playing?

 

[Nosferatu]

19 years experience should teach you about "value" and "reaching" though. And leaving Brees on the board while selecting Cam is terrible...no matter what you think will happen. Calling a Brees injury is unwise strategy. Taking Brees ahead of everyone but Peyton has nothing to do with last year's numbers...take a look at Brees' consistency, there aren't many like him.

I never said i'd make the move I said I don't think it's a horrible move. It's not a reach if it's 6 points per passing TD. I Didn't say he would get injured either. There aren't many like him but it's not gonna last forever.

Honestly the way I have always played is never draft a QB early, I don't think i've taken a QB earlier than round 3 in 15 years.

 

[Nosferatu]

And I'm glad to say I am not in, never was the in, nor will I ever be in a league with owners like that.... especially the kicker in 5th...just stupid...why bother playing?

You must not be in any random on-line leagues...

It's a league i've been in for 7 years now and one I just randomly joined and we lost someone from the previous year so the commish brought in this new guy but it's a free league so who cares.

 

[Nosferatu]

Saying if Cam throws 30 and runs n 10 more, and if Brees gets hurt are two stretches.

You might notice the "IF" part of that first statment and why is it such a stretch? Brees didn't start throwing 40 TD"s a year when he first started.

 

[tlance]

Taking him second overall in a 6 pt per TD pass league would not be a horrible move. Is it one i'd make? Probably not but it's not horrible...

ADP also means nothing to me, I might look at it but in no way do I use that as a guide. People are morons, I was in a league last year where a guy drafted a kicker in the 5th round. I was in a league last year where a guy took Willis McGahee in the 3rd. Not everyone playing fantasy football knows what the heck they are doing.

It is silly to argue this because clearly it is not a pick you would make, but as I referenced earlier Cam's value relative to other QBs is significantly lower in 6 point passing TD leagues. That does not mean it is impossible for him to finish the year as a top 2 QB, but again, that would not make it a good draft pick. If you are going to take him ahead of Brees or Rodgers, the only place where it might make sense is in a league where passing TDs are worth 4.

As another example, it is easy to look at last year's numbers and say that you would have been smart to draft Peyton in the first round. I say BS. You would have been smart to draft Peyton in the 2nd or early third. Teams who had Peyton would not have been as good if they had used their first pick to get him. If you reach too far for your breakout stud, you lose out on the potential profit that would have been realized by drafting an elite performer in the middle rounds.

If Cam is this year's Peyton (doubtful, but possible), then take him in the third after drafting 2 cornerstone players in rounds 1 and 2. Taking him in the first round is always going to be a poor value, because he will be available later. If he isn't, then whoever took him will pay the price for overreaching even if he does blow up.

It isn't about the production. Taking Cam in the first is like walking into an auto dealership and offering to pay 10K over the sticker price. This is not a winning strategy.