Time For Belichick to Vacate the GM Seat??

[YankeeRebel]

@BigKen ; BK you absolutely come off as a bandwagon BB fan, and now that we are in rebuild mode which most of knew would take some time you havenlt the patience to wait. You got spoiled by success. As for the Parcells comment, I feel Parcells benefitted more from BB than BB did Parcells. Its was BBs defense winning in NY that is the truth. No team can lose the GOAT, be cap tight and turn things around in two or three years. BB did what he does, he built the defense first and is now getting the offense in shape. I am equally unsure how is "Acting Like a 12 year old boy" no idea where that comes from. Your posts scream of bandwagon fan you just don't see it.

 

[BigKen]

I've been a "Patriots" fan since I was 10 years old when the team was officially licensed by the AFL in 1960.

I was a NY Giants fans from the time we got a TV in 1955 until 1960.

I'm not a "Bandwagon" fan.

I am a common sense fan and not a follower. You fail to see the real stats before and choice to make excuses for BB.

Answer this. Who was Bill Belichick before he was hired by Bill Parcells. Name one outstanding thing he did.

What exactly did he do in Cleveland as Head Coach that placed him above any other coach in the NFL? 1991-1995 36-44. Only winning year was 1994.

Without Tom Brady BB is 79-87, one playoff appearance and one playoff loss.

BB Lifetime is 298-152

With Brady 136-39
Without Brady 51-65

Coaches are judged simply on wins and losses.

No great coach has ever been considered great unless he had a great QB. (P. Brown, Shula, Walsh, Landry, Johnson, Peyton, etc.)
They all had the greatest, Graham, Unitas, Marino, Montana, Young, Aikman, Romo, Brees. Some didn't win, even with a great QB ie: Manning.

I admit, I don't adore Bill Belichick. I respect the hell out of what he's accomplished, but I also recognize that he would never have won 6 SBs with Drew Bledsoe or Brian Hoyer. Whether you want to admit it or not, Quarterbacks have made their head coaches great.

BB is floundering in mediocrity. Until he finds a Mahomes, Allen or Herbert, you will be consistently says, "He's rebuilding. He's getting the defense in place and the offense is coming along." In December we all will be saying, "Just wait until March. BB will have $168M ib cap space and will put the Patriots back in the super bowl. Or will the real BB take over and wait four days before signing "Really good" players?

In my opinion, Bill Belichick is mired in the 2000-2010 era and he'll never be able to make the jump to 2023.

Like me. He's just too old to do it.

 

[Southieinnc]

NESN and NBC Sports Boston have both said that he willing to take one year on Vet Min.

Sharky, I don't "hate" Belichick. He has several issues and personality things that I don't care for.

The first is that he's been the GM/HC for so long that he feels he is untouchable and answers to no one.

The second is that he's won eight Super Bowl Rings and two were as a DC under Parcells and six with TB12 as his QB. In his terms as HC, he is a .500 coach without TB12 as his QB. Without Parcells or Bardy, he is not an extra-Ordinary HC or GM.

The third is that he's beginning to act like a 12-year-old in a 71-year-old man's body. He refuses to answer any question asked by the Boston media with a straight honest answer. It's as if he crosses his arms and sticks his tongue out because he's always been able to get away with it.Yesterday he was on a podcast with some guy named Irwin and he profusely answered every question and expounded on them. Quote by Michael Holley (co-author of two Belichick books) "Irwin is an old friend."

The fourth thing is that he has not been making good decisions as far as personnel are concerned for the past three years. For twenty years, during the TB12 era, the Patriots had several players selected as AL-Pros every single year. Judon is it now. Guess what?? He's hinting publicly that he wants a new contract because edge rushers, even the piss poor ones are making more than him. What did Bill say? "He has two more years left on his present contract." Think Judon will resign next year if offered??? He'll most likely be in NYC.

At 71, all men, regardless of who they are, begin the walk to the end. I'm 73, work out six days a week, do math puzzles and brain teasers to stay as physically and mentally as good as possible. I can't pick up a hundred pounds of anything anymore. I don't have the physical dexterity to quickly play anything on my guitar. As a matter of fact, I'm having a hell of a time getting my left wrist to bend enough to properly hold down the strings with my left fingers. My hand-eye coordination is getting slower as is my mental response. I'm two years old than BB, but I at least admit that I can no longer do the same things I did when I was 53.

There comes a point in time where one has to start letting go. It's time for BB to be the best HC in the NFL and let someone else do the personnel stuff. GMs today have to be quick, understand what's happening before they happen and do something to protect or adjust his team. Bill will always do what Bill always does. That's no longer enough. It may even be a hindrance. If this was a36 HC/GM, the media would be screaming for him to "Grow up." Bill's too old to grow up. It's time to "let go."

Can you repeat that? I didn't "hear"

 

[YankeeRebel]

I've been a "Patriots" fan since I was 10 years old when the team was officially licensed by the AFL in 1960.

I was a NY Giants fans from the time we got a TV in 1955 until 1960.

I'm not a "Bandwagon" fan.

I am a common sense fan and not a follower. You fail to see the real stats before and choice to make excuses for BB.

Answer this. Who was Bill Belichick before he was hired by Bill Parcells. Name one outstanding thing he did.

What exactly did he do in Cleveland as Head Coach that placed him above any other coach in the NFL? 1991-1995 36-44. Only winning year was 1994.

Without Tom Brady BB is 79-87, one playoff appearance and one playoff loss.

BB Lifetime is 298-152

With Brady 136-39
Without Brady 51-65

Coaches are judged simply on wins and losses.

No great coach has ever been considered great unless he had a great QB. (P. Brown, Shula, Walsh, Landry, Johnson, Peyton, etc.)
They all had the greatest, Graham, Unitas, Marino, Montana, Young, Aikman, Romo, Brees. Some didn't win, even with a great QB ie: Manning.

I admit, I don't adore Bill Belichick. I respect the hell out of what he's accomplished, but I also recognize that he would never have won 6 SBs with Drew Bledsoe or Brian Hoyer. Whether you want to admit it or not, Quarterbacks have made their head coaches great.

BB is floundering in mediocrity. Until he finds a Mahomes, Allen or Herbert, you will be consistently says, "He's rebuilding. He's getting the defense in place and the offense is coming along." In December we all will be saying, "Just wait until March. BB will have $168M ib cap space and will put the Patriots back in the super bowl. Or will the real BB take over and wait four days before signing "Really good" players?

In my opinion, Bill Belichick is mired in the 2000-2010 era and he'll never be able to make the jump to 2023.

Like me. He's just too old to do it.

I think I said you present as a bandwagon fan which you do. When things aren't all roses you pick apart everyone and everything. You may not see it that way, but it presents that way

 

[Southieinnc]

I've been a "Patriots" fan since I was 10 years old when the team was officially licensed by the AFL in 1960.

I was a NY Giants fans from the time we got a TV in 1955 until 1960.

I'm not a "Bandwagon" fan.

I am a common sense fan and not a follower. You fail to see the real stats before and choice to make excuses for BB.

Answer this. Who was Bill Belichick before he was hired by Bill Parcells. Name one outstanding thing he did.

What exactly did he do in Cleveland as Head Coach that placed him above any other coach in the NFL? 1991-1995 36-44. Only winning year was 1994.

Without Tom Brady BB is 79-87, one playoff appearance and one playoff loss.

BB Lifetime is 298-152

With Brady 136-39
Without Brady 51-65

Coaches are judged simply on wins and losses.

No great coach has ever been considered great unless he had a great QB. (P. Brown, Shula, Walsh, Landry, Johnson, Peyton, etc.)
They all had the greatest, Graham, Unitas, Marino, Montana, Young, Aikman, Romo, Brees. Some didn't win, even with a great QB ie: Manning.

I admit, I don't adore Bill Belichick. I respect the hell out of what he's accomplished, but I also recognize that he would never have won 6 SBs with Drew Bledsoe or Brian Hoyer. Whether you want to admit it or not, Quarterbacks have made their head coaches great.

BB is floundering in mediocrity. Until he finds a Mahomes, Allen or Herbert, you will be consistently says, "He's rebuilding. He's getting the defense in place and the offense is coming along." In December we all will be saying, "Just wait until March. BB will have $168M ib cap space and will put the Patriots back in the super bowl. Or will the real BB take over and wait four days before signing "Really good" players?

In my opinion, Bill Belichick is mired in the 2000-2010 era and he'll never be able to make the jump to 2023.

Like me. He's just too old to do it.

NFL odds: Most popular win total bet is Patriots, as bettors trust Bill Belichick

The Patriots are a surprisingly popular team among future bettors.

sports.yahoo.com

 

[sharkymcwrath]

The fourth thing is that he has not been making good decisions as far as personnel are concerned for the past three years.

Holy fuck dude!

2020: Kyle Duggar, Josh Uche, Michael Onwenu
2021: Mac Jones(jury still out but he's a starting QB), Christian Barnmore, Rhamondre Stevenson
2022: Cole Strange, Tyquan Thornton(jury still out but he's a starter), Marcus Jones, Jack Jones. Plus Zappe, Kevin Harris and Pierre Strong.

Those are solid fucking drafts and the 2023 draft is shaping up to have the potential to be BB's greatest draft ever.

Plus we have a bunch of solid veterans we signed.

 

[Yankee Traveler]

I've been a "Patriots" fan since I was 10 years old when the team was officially licensed by the AFL in 1960.

I was a NY Giants fans from the time we got a TV in 1955 until 1960.

I'm not a "Bandwagon" fan.

I am a common sense fan and not a follower. You fail to see the real stats before and choice to make excuses for BB.

Answer this. Who was Bill Belichick before he was hired by Bill Parcells. Name one outstanding thing he did.

What exactly did he do in Cleveland as Head Coach that placed him above any other coach in the NFL? 1991-1995 36-44. Only winning year was 1994.

Without Tom Brady BB is 79-87, one playoff appearance and one playoff loss.

BB Lifetime is 298-152

With Brady 136-39
Without Brady 51-65

Coaches are judged simply on wins and losses.

No great coach has ever been considered great unless he had a great QB. (P. Brown, Shula, Walsh, Landry, Johnson, Peyton, etc.)
They all had the greatest, Graham, Unitas, Marino, Montana, Young, Aikman, Romo, Brees. Some didn't win, even with a great QB ie: Manning.

I admit, I don't adore Bill Belichick. I respect the hell out of what he's accomplished, but I also recognize that he would never have won 6 SBs with Drew Bledsoe or Brian Hoyer. Whether you want to admit it or not, Quarterbacks have made their head coaches great.

BB is floundering in mediocrity. Until he finds a Mahomes, Allen or Herbert, you will be consistently says, "He's rebuilding. He's getting the defense in place and the offense is coming along." In December we all will be saying, "Just wait until March. BB will have $168M ib cap space and will put the Patriots back in the super bowl. Or will the real BB take over and wait four days before signing "Really good" players?

In my opinion, Bill Belichick is mired in the 2000-2010 era and he'll never be able to make the jump to 2023.

Like me. He's just too old to do it.

1) Without Belichick there may not have been a Brady. At all.

2) Without Belichick's defense there is no Superbowls for the first half of the dynasty - '01, '03 & '04

3) Without Belichick's handling of free agency and the cap there is no second half of the dynasty - '14, '16 & '18.

4) Without Belichick there is no greatness to Brady and he doesn't get to cherry pick a situation for #7.

Spare me.

 

[redskinsfan1963]

i am not a pats fan,but i think bb is one of the nfl,s best coaches.i don,t think there is any way the pats fire him regardless of his record.

 

[Yankee Traveler]

Holy fuck dude!

2020: Kyle Duggar, Josh Uche, Michael Onwenu
2021: Mac Jones(jury still out but he's a starting QB), Christian Barnmore, Rhamondre Stevenson
2022: Cole Strange, Tyquan Thornton(jury still out but he's a starter), Marcus Jones, Jack Jones. Plus Zappe, Kevin Harris and Pierre Strong.

Those are solid fucking drafts and the 2023 draft is shaping up to have the potential to be BB's greatest draft ever.

Plus we have a bunch of solid veterans we signed.

Yeahbut...DHop left town.


Mass Taxes vs TN 0% state taxes had nothing to do with it.
Vrabel & Kelly vs BOB had nothing to do with it.
Mass weather vs TN weather had nothing to do with it.

Bill was fucking a dog and that's all it was.

Typical Bill.

 

[BigKen]

Holy fuck dude!

2020: Kyle Duggar, Josh Uche, Michael Onwenu
2021: Mac Jones(jury still out but he's a starting QB), Christian Barnmore, Rhamondre Stevenson
2022: Cole Strange, Tyquan Thornton(jury still out but he's a starter), Marcus Jones, Jack Jones. Plus Zappe, Kevin Harris and Pierre Strong.

Those are solid fucking drafts and the 2023 draft is shaping up to have the potential to be BB's greatest draft ever.

Plus we have a bunch of solid veterans we signed.

I should have been more direct and said "skill Positions".

 

[BigKen]

1) Without Belichick there may not have been a Brady. At all.

2) Without Belichick's defense there is no Superbowls for the first half of the dynasty - '01, '03 & '04

3) Without Belichick's handling of free agency and the cap there is no second half of the dynasty - '14, '16 & '18.

4) Without Belichick there is no greatness to Brady and he doesn't get to cherry pick a situation for #7.

1) BB did not want to draft Brady. He had Bledsoe.
2) '01, '03, '04 TB12 @ QB
3) '14, ''16, '19 TB12 @ QB
4) Sketchy opinion here. No one can say what would have happened if any other team had drafted him. Complete unknown.

If BB hadn't drafted TB12, We all might still be looking for just a shot of making the AFCG and not nine in a row, let alone 9 SB appearances.

 

[BigKen]

We keep getting off the subject.

I have zero issue with BB staying as HC.

I would like to see someone take the GM load off his back and have a different approach to the draft and free agency selection.

 

[sharkymcwrath]

I should have been more direct and said "skill Positions".

QB, WR, and RB aren't skill positions?

 

[armadillooutlaw]

RBs have the NFLPA worked up. Taylor and couple of others are basically hinting that they're willing to sit out. Taylor wants to be traded and Irsay said, "No way I trade him." If he can get a few more "name" guys to consider sitting out for a better salary range, a strike within the union could cause a huge problem.

Like Taylor says, RBs take more of a beating than any other position and have the shortest careers. Time to pony up.

Bill ain't gonna get anyone of stature or statistics for less than $10M. Union will back these guys and demand bigger salaries.

Just have McCaffrey, Barkley, and few others join a sit out. It won't take long for the RB salary scale to move up to $15-$20M.

Zeke Elliott is a 2-4M a year back at best these days. He's a goal line back/pass blocking RB and has less juice than Blount did for you guys several years back.

 

[nefansince75]

NESN and NBC Sports Boston have both said that he willing to take one year on Vet Min.

Sharky, I don't "hate" Belichick. He has several issues and personality things that I don't care for.

The first is that he's been the GM/HC for so long that he feels he is untouchable and answers to no one.

The second is that he's won eight Super Bowl Rings and two were as a DC under Parcells and six with TB12 as his QB. In his terms as HC, he is a .500 coach without TB12 as his QB. Without Parcells or Bardy, he is not an extra-Ordinary HC or GM.

The third is that he's beginning to act like a 12-year-old in a 71-year-old man's body. He refuses to answer any question asked by the Boston media with a straight honest answer. It's as if he crosses his arms and sticks his tongue out because he's always been able to get away with it.Yesterday he was on a podcast with some guy named Irwin and he profusely answered every question and expounded on them. Quote by Michael Holley (co-author of two Belichick books) "Irwin is an old friend."

The fourth thing is that he has not been making good decisions as far as personnel are concerned for the past three years. For twenty years, during the TB12 era, the Patriots had several players selected as AL-Pros every single year. Judon is it now. Guess what?? He's hinting publicly that he wants a new contract because edge rushers, even the piss poor ones are making more than him. What did Bill say? "He has two more years left on his present contract." Think Judon will resign next year if offered??? He'll most likely be in NYC.

At 71, all men, regardless of who they are, begin the walk to the end. I'm 73, work out six days a week, do math puzzles and brain teasers to stay as physically and mentally as good as possible. I can't pick up a hundred pounds of anything anymore. I don't have the physical dexterity to quickly play anything on my guitar. As a matter of fact, I'm having a hell of a time getting my left wrist to bend enough to properly hold down the strings with my left fingers. My hand-eye coordination is getting slower as is my mental response. I'm two years old than BB, but I at least admit that I can no longer do the same things I did when I was 53.

There comes a point in time where one has to start letting go. It's time for BB to be the best HC in the NFL and let someone else do the personnel stuff. GMs today have to be quick, understand what's happening before they happen and do something to protect or adjust his team. Bill will always do what Bill always does. That's no longer enough. It may even be a hindrance. If this was a36 HC/GM, the media would be screaming for him to "Grow up." Bill's too old to grow up. It's time to "let go."

First off, 500 ball in Cleveland was a decent accomplishment. He inherited a bad team, then had to deal with that crap storm after the Browns announced they were leaving town. Then he inherited a dysfunctional team in Foxboro and straightened out it heading into year 2.

The time after Brady was always going to suck for whoever was coaching.

Brady or no Brady, BB ain't an average coach. When the Pats were about to lose to the Squealhawks in SB49, was it Brady who made the calls that set the wheels in motion that led to BB hoisting a trophy and Pete Carrol racing to empty his shorts? Sure, it was Butler who executed the crucial play, but who didn't panic and pretty much dictated the play the 'hawks would call into the coverage designed to stop it?

 

[nefansince75]

I've been a "Patriots" fan since I was 10 years old when the team was officially licensed by the AFL in 1960.

I was a NY Giants fans from the time we got a TV in 1955 until 1960.

I'm not a "Bandwagon" fan.

I am a common sense fan and not a follower. You fail to see the real stats before and choice to make excuses for BB.

Answer this. Who was Bill Belichick before he was hired by Bill Parcells. Name one outstanding thing he did.

What exactly did he do in Cleveland as Head Coach that placed him above any other coach in the NFL? 1991-1995 36-44. Only winning year was 1994.

Without Tom Brady BB is 79-87, one playoff appearance and one playoff loss.

BB Lifetime is 298-152

With Brady 136-39
Without Brady 51-65

Coaches are judged simply on wins and losses.

No great coach has ever been considered great unless he had a great QB. (P. Brown, Shula, Walsh, Landry, Johnson, Peyton, etc.)
They all had the greatest, Graham, Unitas, Marino, Montana, Young, Aikman, Romo, Brees. Some didn't win, even with a great QB ie: Manning.

I admit, I don't adore Bill Belichick. I respect the hell out of what he's accomplished, but I also recognize that he would never have won 6 SBs with Drew Bledsoe or Brian Hoyer. Whether you want to admit it or not, Quarterbacks have made their head coaches great.

BB is floundering in mediocrity. Until he finds a Mahomes, Allen or Herbert, you will be consistently says, "He's rebuilding. He's getting the defense in place and the offense is coming along." In December we all will be saying, "Just wait until March. BB will have $168M ib cap space and will put the Patriots back in the super bowl. Or will the real BB take over and wait four days before signing "Really good" players?

In my opinion, Bill Belichick is mired in the 2000-2010 era and he'll never be able to make the jump to 2023.

Like me. He's just too old to do it.

Who was BB before Parcels isn't the right question. Why did Parcels hire him as DC is the better question. The simple answer is: Because Parcels is nobody's fool. The more complicated answer is: When Parcels was DC his desk abutted BB's. Small talk between them led to BB giving BP suggestions which led to BP seeing his unmatched work ethic and tremendous analytical ability. How'd that choice work out for BP?

 

[sharkymcwrath]

Brady or no Brady, BB ain't an average coach. When the Pats were about to lose to the Squealhawks in SB49, was it Brady who made the calls that set the wheels in motion that led to BB hoisting a trophy and Pete Carrol racing to empty his shorts? Sure, it was Butler who executed the crucial play, but who didn't panic and pretty much dictated the play the 'hawks would call into the coverage designed to stop it?

Not calling time out and letting the clock run down while we all thought Lynch was a sure TD was perhaps the greatest coaching move ever. I forget exactly but he could've left about 40-ish seconds or so on the clock in case Lynch did indeed score.

Balls of steel right there.

 

[YankeeRebel]

1) BB did not want to draft Brady. He had Bledsoe.
2) '01, '03, '04 TB12 @ QB
3) '14, ''16, '19 TB12 @ QB
4) Sketchy opinion here. No one can say what would have happened if any other team had drafted him. Complete unknown.

If BB hadn't drafted TB12, We all might still be looking for just a shot of making the AFCG and not nine in a row, let alone 9 SB appearances.

Why was he on BBs draft board then? BB had scouted him and had planned on Brady. I remember specifically him saying he was surprised Brady was there in round six

 

[YankeeRebel]

1) BB did not want to draft Brady. He had Bledsoe.
2) '01, '03, '04 TB12 @ QB
3) '14, ''16, '19 TB12 @ QB
4) Sketchy opinion here. No one can say what would have happened if any other team had drafted him. Complete unknown.

If BB hadn't drafted TB12, We all might still be looking for just a shot of making the AFCG and not nine in a row, let alone 9 SB appearances.

Yeah 01 03 04 TB was the QB but coaching and defense won those games

 

[NWPATSFAN]

The was it BB or TB argument is ridiculous. They both complimented each other. It was the perfect storm. With lots of turbulence. We can second guess and speculate all day, but that's all it is.

Would NE have had the same success if either of them were missing? Probably not.

My pesonal opinion, for what it's worth is BB should've given Brady pretty much anything he asked for. Based solely on what Tom did for NE.

BB misplayed that one.

Yes, I would've sacraficed a handful of down years to keep Tom in NE until he retired.

I am of the thinking BB should give up his GM duties. Being 71 it can't be easy running on all cylinders. Focus on coaching and let a GM focus on players with BB given some of the vote.