Next Year Will Be Exciting

[navamind]

I already stated why Revere is an excellent hitter. I showed how he clearly improved his hitting - .200, .312,.354,and .388 - 96 hits in 88 games. That is the whole picture. Hitting .300 is vital for a lead off hitter. You say Revere is less than average. No one can believe that when the opposite has been clearly shown. The lead off hitter "creates runs" by getting on base. He likely would have finished the year much higher than .305; that is not delusional, but probable.

Delmon was always a slugger. He would have done better as a Phillie by leading off? It's just dumb trying to compare the two. Revere is a leadoff hitter. It took a month for him to find his comfort zone with a new team and new park. That's the psychological aspect to baseball.

By the way, since you like the comparison, in 88 games (incl April), Revere was .339 with runners on and .352 w/risp; hitting with 2 outs .341; scoring posn, 2 out .441. Delmon in 80 games was .229 with runners on and .256 risp; hitting with 2 outs, .235, scoring posn, 2 out .313. Revere wins over the slugger. lol. What else can I say.

Lol yea, that .141 ISO screams slugger.

I think what you meant to say "Delmon was always a bad hitter"

 

[Omar 382]

Lol yea, that .141 ISO screams slugger.

I think what you meant to say "Delmon was always a bad hitter"

Don't try to reason with him...

 

[jvett77]

Lol yea, that .141 ISO screams slugger.

I think what you meant to say "Delmon was always a bad hitter"

navamind, the topic was Revere, not Delmon. As I said, it's pointless to compare the two. Delmon (100 HRs in 7 years, ) is obviously more of a 'slugger' than Revere will ever be. I don't care how bad or good Delmon is.

 

[jvett77]

Don't try to reason with him...

You brought up Delmon in comment # 12 to somehow show that is a better hitter and more valuable than Revere. Failure and pointless. Case closed.

 

[Omar 382]

Except that Young is a more valuable hitter than Revere.

 

[Progeriakid]

Wow my IQ dropped at least a 100 points after reading the OP's posts! Clueless? Homer? Both?

 

[Caligula]

Next year is going to blow.

 

[jvett77]

Except that Young is a more valuable hitter than Revere.

And you preferred lineup position for Delmon on the Phillies on the Phillies is?

 

[Omar 382]

...

 

[jvett77]

...

Thanks for giving up. I was afraid the pointless comparison would go on until Ruben brought back Delmon to be a bench player in 2014 because of his high value.

 

[jvett77]

Except that Young is a more valuable hitter than Revere.

Just needed to correct my comment on this.

The stats below clearly show that Revere is immensely more valuable than Delmon using 2013 stats.

________G_____Hits_____BA____Runs___rbi____risp___LHP___RHP___Runners On
Revere__88____96______.305___37_____17____.352___.285__.370___.339
Delmon__80____87______.260___30_____31____.235___.260__.261___.229

Delmon stinks vs. Revere. Sabermetrics stats like wRC+ work better for Fantasy Baseball, where runs are the only game in town, but ML ballplayers could never be paid according to those stats because you really don't know how they're derived. Like what weight is a "run" given vs an rbi. Regardless, Delmon stinks, however. it does appear he's a little better than Mayberry, Jr. Also he scored only 30 runs, not 68, as you stated in one of your earlier comments.

 

[Omar 382]

Just needed to correct my comment on this.

The stats below clearly show that Revere is immensely more valuable than Delmon using 2013 stats.

________G_____Hits_____BA____Runs___rbi____risp___LHP___RHP___Runners On
Revere__88____96______.305___37_____17____.352___.285__.370___.339
Delmon__80____87______.260___30_____31____.235___.260__.261___.229

Delmon stinks vs. Revere. Sabermetrics stats like wRC+ work better for Fantasy Baseball, where runs are the only game in town, but ML ballplayers could never be paid according to those stats because you really don't know how they're derived. Like what weight is a "run" given vs an rbi. Regardless, Delmon stinks, however. it does appear he's a little better than Mayberry, Jr. Also he scored only 30 runs, not 68, as you stated in one of your earlier comments.

I said he had 68 runs plus RBI's LOL. Look I'm tired of beating a dead horse. Delmon is a better offensive player. If a hitter hits .800 but drives in and scores no runs, is he a better offensive player than a batter who hits .245 and drives in 60 runs, and scores 40? Of course not. The name of the game for a hitter is to create runs. Revere can hit all the singles he wants, if he is stranded at first, what did he really do to help us win the game? A player needs to have some power to help the Phillies in this day and age. Maybe in 2008, Revere would have been an asset to have, but not in 2013.

 

[jvett77]

I said he had 68 runs plus RBI's LOL. Look I'm tired of beating a dead horse. Delmon is a better offensive player. If a hitter hits .800 but drives in and scores no runs, is he a better offensive player than a batter who hits .245 and drives in 60 runs, and scores 40? Of course not. The name of the game for a hitter is to create runs. Revere can hit all the singles he wants, if he is stranded at first, what did he really do to help us win the game? A player needs to have some power to help the Phillies in this day and age. Maybe in 2008, Revere would have been an asset to have, but not in 2013.

OK. 68 runs plus RBI's. With saber stats, you end up beating the dead horse, because you're dealing with derivatives of real world stats.

If you put a .400 hitter in a lineup of girl scouts or jimmie poppins, that excellent hitter would look very poor, sabermetrically. Perhaps a wRC+ of .010? I suppose you would conclude he's done nothing to create runs. And what if he had 50 SBs? Not a run creator. lol.

Baseball is a team sport. Power hitters are placed down in the lineup so they can drive in the guys batting at the top, whose job is to get on base. It is desired that the leadoff hitter have a high average and that he is fast. Having power is a plus - like Jimmie in his prime. Power hitter Delmon, at .229 with runners on, doesn't do the job. If Saber stats place Delmon slightly above Revere, then doesn't that embarrass Delmon who is comparable to a lead off singles hitter? Therefore, on any basis, currently, Delmon really blows.

I'll bet if you put another Ben Revere in Delmon's lineup spot, the team would probably have won more games because of rally killer Delmon's inability to come through with runners on (Ks 25% of the time) vs Revere's significantly higher average with runners on, .339 vs .229.

 

[Omar 382]

OK. 68 runs plus RBI's. With saber stats, you end up beating the dead horse, because you're dealing with derivatives of real world stats.

If you put a .400 hitter in a lineup of girl scouts or jimmie poppins, that excellent hitter would look very poor, sabermetrically. Perhaps a wRC+ of .010? I suppose you would conclude he's done nothing to create runs. And what if he had 50 SBs? Not a run creator. lol.

Baseball is a team sport. Power hitters are placed down in the lineup so they can drive in the guys batting at the top, whose job is to get on base. It is desired that the leadoff hitter have a high average and that he is fast. Having power is a plus - like Jimmie in his prime. Power hitter Delmon, at .229 with runners on, doesn't do the job. If Saber stats place Delmon slightly above Revere, then doesn't that embarrass Delmon who is comparable to a lead off singles hitter? Therefore, on any basis, currently, Delmon really blows.

I'll bet if you put another Ben Revere in Delmon's lineup spot, the team would probably have won more games because of rally killer Delmon's inability to come through with runners on (Ks 25% of the time) vs Revere's significantly higher average with runners on, .339 vs .229.

For a team like the 2013 Phillies, ranked 27th in offense, Delmon Young is a more valuable hitter than Revere. If you want to call "hitting" just purely batting average, fine, Ben Revere is a better hitter than Young. But Young is a better offensive player.

 

[Retroram52]

Why don't we find a player who is good at both qualities!

 

[WestCoastPhan]

Ummm next year will not be exciting...unless changes are made. And please can you stop talking about these 2 shitty players...delmon & revere...its really boring.

 

[Omar 382]

I keep trying to let it die but jvett keeps bringing it up.....

 

[jvett77]

For a team like the 2013 Phillies, ranked 27th in offense, Delmon Young is a more valuable hitter than Revere. If you want to call "hitting" just purely batting average, fine, Ben Revere is a better hitter than Young. But Young is a better offensive player.

Of course, "hitting" is more than purely batting average, but non-slugger Revere simply beats Delmon is most situational categories. We know DY has more power but he doesn't use it enough when his team needs it. That's why his wRC+ is close to Revere, a singles hitter. Believe what you want. Revere is the better offensive player. Heck, ask Ed and Rube.

 

[jvett77]

Ummm next year will not be exciting...unless changes are made. And please can you stop talking about these 2 shitty players...delmon & revere...its really boring.

OK. I'll let it die. I've run out of offensive stats any way.