GM's Sick of Z Article (A New One)

[NWinAZ]

Trader Jack? As Seattle's GM struggles to complete deals, some rival executives wonder | FOX Sports

 

[NWinAZ]

Otto Greule Jr / Getty Images North America
Mariners GM Jack Zduriencik hasn't yet made the big move everyone is expecting as his team slips a bit in the standings.











The Mariners already have completed one trade, acquiring designated hitter Kendrys Morales from the Twins last week. General manager Jack Zduriencik could make one or two more deals before the non-waiver deadline Thursday at 4 p.m. ET, maybe even a blockbuster.
To hear rival executives tell it, though, Zduriencik mostly has exasperated trade partners with his negotiating style while trying to guide the M’s to the postseason for the first time since 2001. Those executives say the Mariners frequently inquire on a number of players, only to shift direction when a deal appears within reach.
Such conduct is not unusual for teams navigating the complex trade market. But in numerous conversations, executives from other teams have singled out Zduriencik as one of the most difficult GMs in the sport with whom to do business. Zdurincik’s peers express frustration with his methods – and their complaints are not new.
The rival executives spoke on condition of anonymity because of tampering rules and the ongoing nature of trade conversations. And while Zduriencik is free to conduct business however he sees fit, his peers say the trade market is clogged in part due to the Mariners’ stalled pursuits of players such as the Rays’ David Price, Rangers’ Alex Rios and Phillies’ Marlon Byrd.
Meanwhile, the situation is turning urgent for the Mariners, who are 3-7 since the All-Star break and now just three games above .500. Zduriencik, who reportedly is unsigned beyond 2014, also is in a delicate spot. The M’s went 85-77 in ’09, his first season, then produced losing records in each of the past four years.
Some GMs turn aggressive when their jobs seemingly are at stake. Zduriencik, on the other hand, baffles rival executives with his inability to close deals.
“He has made offers and then pulled back after we have said, ‘This is something we would do,”’ one executive said. “He responds (by saying) it wasn’t an offer and that he will need to discuss it with his guys.”
Another executive added, “I don’t always get the sense that he knows what he wants to do. One day, he’s interested in one thing. The next day, he’s interested in another. That’s what makes it challenging.”







A third executive said, “They (the Mariners) don’t set out on a trade saying, ‘Here’s what we need. Let’s do what we can to get him.’ They think, ‘Who can we give up that will never be any good?’ They don’t want to give up anyone who will haunt them. That’s just flat-out fear.”
Zduriencik, in a lengthy E-mail to FOX Sports, responded by saying that the in-and-out nature of his trade conversations are typical of those that occur throughout the industry.
“There are many discussions that take place throughout the year, and I am open in my dialogue and intent,” Zduriencik said. “I have not had an offer on the table and pulled it back. I have been clear in my discussions and often express my intentions.
“I have done enough deals, signed enough players in my history, that this alone should speak to this subject. Inquiries, discussions, dialogue, and even the exchange of names does not mean a deal will get done, and all GMs realize this. Many times there are varying points as names go in and out from both parties. There are so many factors that go into any trade that most clubs realize how hard and sensitive this subject can be.
“If any trade or discussion does not get consummated, it is simply that we did not agree on the exchange. As a general manager, I have had my share of deals turned down, and I have turned down deals as well. It simply works both ways.”
Zduriencik added, “As far as the fear factor of a player doing well elsewhere, that comment is ridiculous! I would hope that every GM wishes his players the very best and success as they move on to other ballclubs. It’s just part of the business of baseball. It is my job to do what is best for the Seattle Mariners.”
The Mariners are drawing increased attention from other clubs not only because of their emergence as a surprise contender but also because of their reservoir of young talent. Teams view Seattle as an attractive trading partner, and the M’s have an obvious need for offense – they lead the American League in ERA but are next-to-last in runs scored.









The AL West title is all but out of reach for the Mariners, who trail the Athletics by 11 games, the Angels by 9½. The second wild card is a more realistic target – the M’s are a mere 1½ games behind the Blue Jays in that race. But the only assurance that a wild card offers is a one-game playoff, with the winner advancing to the best-of-five Division Series.
Rival executives view even the one trade that Zduriencik has made thus far as curious. The Mariners not only gave up right-handed reliever Stephen Pryor for Morales but also agreed to pay the remainder of the approximately $4.33 million remaining on Morales’ contract. This for a player who was batting .234 with a .584 OPS – and since has gone 1-for-10 in his first three games with the Mariners.
The trade did squelch the notion that the Mariners were operating without payroll flexibility – a notion Zduriencik himself perpetuated, rival executives say.
“I have an ownership group that’s as tired of losing as our fan base is,” team president Kevin Mather told FOX Sports last week. “I get tired of reading that our player payroll is $89 million or $90 million. We’re well over $100 million, and we just added Morales. We feel good about where we are, and we do have some flexibility.”
The question now is whether Zduriencik can capitalize on that flexibility – and whether Mariners ownership is influencing the GM’s stop-and-start behavior. Former club officials have accused ownership of meddling in the past.
Zduriencik, who took over as GM on Oct. 22, 2008, was an assertive deal-maker in his early years, completing a three-team, 12-player trade at his first winter meetings and acquiring left-hander Cliff Lee from the Phillies at his second. But he got a poor return for Lee from the Rangers the following July, then sent right-hander Doug Fister to the Tigers in another ill-conceived deal the next year.
Since then, Zduriencik’s trades mostly have brought low-impact returns. Second baseman Robinson Cano, the Mariners’ biggest acquisition last offseason, was a $240 million free-agent signing. The team’s only trade of consequence was pitcher Carter Capps for first baseman Logan Morrison. Their only trade last July sent infielder Robert Andino to the Pirates for a player to be named.
The next four days, then, could amount to the most significant test of Zduriencik’s tenure in Seattle. He will either defy the criticism of him within the industry or spark renewed questions about whether he is fit for the job.

 

[FirebreathingMonkey]

I find myself wondering this more and more each day if Jack-Z either has no clue what's hes doing and lied to get the GM job or if the front office tells him to "just look busy" so they can tell the fans their are trying. Or it could be both.


Side note saw this earlier today

Rosenthal also [ame="[MEDIA=twitter]493877558593982464[/MEDIA]"]tweets[/ame] that the Mariners have inquired on Lester, who is a native of Tacoma.

 

[NWinAZ]

He seems to call on everyone, but trades for no one. It is a great way to snow the fans as you mentioned. I am a big believer he is over his head and M's don't care. He snowed them and now he is snowing us. Welcome to Mariner baseball.

 

[SeattleCoug]

Second negative article Rosenthal has had about him recently. If you count the Baker article that's three negative articles in a 7 month span. I mean I dont have words to describe how pathetic this is

 

[NWinAZ]

Not to mention all the bad comments by fired or released ex-management. Not a well liked guy apparently. Go figure.

 

[NWinAZ]

Dysfunction at the top: Eric Wedge, others point to trouble in Mariners’ front office | Mariners | The Seattle Times

Jack Zduriencik deserves blame for communication breakdown with Eric Wedge | Jerry Brewer | The Seattle Times

Just a couple old articles on the great Z.

 

[cezero]

Blengino's comments are what get me. He's a real sabr guy. Former accountant, good with numbers, now does work with fangraphs. Z doesn't know what the hell he's doing, and it sounds like he just fires anybody who disagrees with him.

 

[gowazzu02]

Weird article... First i hate unnamed sources....if your gonna say it own it, if not shut your mouth

With that said, i don't hate it. I mean jack z is tryng to acquire talent and give up as little as possible. Would we rather the same unnamed gutless sources say, man jack z that guy is who you wanna go to when you need to pull a bavasi? Sounds like these gms want to eff us and have jack z pay the bar tab if you get what im saying.....

 

[cezero]

Morosi's on 710 ESPN talking about this article right now.

Z sent an email to Morosi and Rosenthal right after and wasn't happy with the tone of the article.

Morosi's saying this isn't just a 2014 thing. It's a regularly understood thing for execs around baseball. It has to be unnamed sources to avoid tampering. Don't think for an instant somebody's just making this stuff up.

Brought up Upton not being Z's fault.

When asked if he thought Z would keep his job, Morosi said that "it takes a different set of skills" to make the finishing touches on a roster that the M's would need to become a championship team. On the other hand, he said there weren't many GM's who could.

Morosi talked about Byrd being a better choice than Kemp for the rest of this season. Also said Ramirez from the White Sox would be a good SS to go after.

"It's so obvious what they need!" was my favorite thing that Morosi said when talking about the M's.

 

[NWinAZ]

Blengino's comments are what get me. He's a real sabr guy. Former accountant, good with numbers, now does work with fangraphs. Z doesn't know what the hell he's doing, and it sounds like he just fires anybody who disagrees with him.

Absolute truth. The other part if I remember right is that he and Z were good friends and Z brought him in. The man is willing to throw anyone he can including friends under a bus to save himself and those guys don't last because he quickly runs out of friends to sacrifice.

 

[NWinAZ]

FROM Mouthpiece of the M's Drayer:

With the trade deadline coming up Thursday and the rumornado in full swirl, I think it is probably time to address a few issues.
• First of all, you have heard the Mariners name brought up in a number of rumors and you will hear it even more in the coming days. Any rumor that begins with, or more specifically constitutes only that "the Mariners have inquired about" is exactly that – they have asked.
At this point they have asked about everyone. It is what they do. Jack Zduriencik has had conversations with every GM in baseball about every player they possibly could make available and those they may not. This does not mean a deal is imminent or that it even got beyond the asking phase. It is something to report however, and that is why you see it.
• There has been a strange shift in trade talk today from Dodgers outfielder Matt Kemp to Red Sox ace Jon Lester (an inquired-about player). For all the talk of the Mariners having serious interest in Kemp, I am hearing that a deal is highly unlikely.
I have heard, and this certainly could change as the clock ticks down, that the Dodgers do not want to eat a large amount of the roughly $118 million left on his contract. I have little question this would knock the Mariners out of any serious consideration for a trade. In my opinion this is a good thing. 2011 Kemp would be a great fit. 2014 Kemp seems to be heading in the wrong direction. The Mariners need help in the outfield for now and the future and this is not the player you build around.
The thing to remember here, and it applies to Rays pitcher David Price as well, is any big dollars deal the Mariners make now will impact what they can do in the future. If they spend big dollars now (if they are available, which we don't know) then they most likely won't have those dollars in the offseason. Because of the number of needs they still have on offense it has to be the right player who is a fit for now and the future.
• The phone calls go two ways between the Mariners and other clubs. GMs will ask about Kyle Seager knowing they will get nowhere; probably the same with Mike Zunino. It's easy to say you want to hold on to both. But what about Dustin Ackley or Michael Saunders? I have heard both have been drawing a good amount of interest from other teams. For what would you part with either? Does Ackley's July change your thoughts on moving him?
• The Mariners have expressed interest in Rangers outfielder Alex Rios. Who would you not be willing to deal to a division rival?
• Joel Sherman has an interesting article about the Mariners at the deadline in the New York Post today. He and others wonder why the Mariners are still focusing on acquiring an arm when their clear need is a bat or three. Here is the quote from Zduriencik that caught my eye.
"If you consider David Price a (grade) A and the only thing available to you as a hitter is a C-plus hitter, you are better off with the A pitcher," Zduriencik said. "It really all depends what opportunity presents itself. What are you giving up to what are you getting back? It is clear you can't win without pitching. And it is clear we need offensive help. There is a lot of jockeying going on right now (about what prices are for players). Nothing is clear cut what we will do."
It certainly is not clear cut, but this smacks of making a move to make a move if plan A or B does not come through. I hope we don't see that. That is what we saw when Doug Fister was traded to the Tigers. Price or any other elite pitcher with this offense as it is today most likely will not get this team to the playoffs.
I have understood and been on board with any plan that brings back a starter, but to go for a grade A starter at grade A prices in both dollars and prospects, which you then would not have available for other moves, does not make sense to me. Big dollars for a starter with the needs you have on offense does not make sense to me in general. If you are going to roll the dice, bet on your pitching.
To be clear, Zduriencik did not say he would do this and that nothing was clear cut in what he would do. This is what I hope we don't see.
• One more interesting article – and this one is for you, Tony Matias. We have heard it before, but rival executives are once again spouting off to FOXSports.com reporters about the Mariners, or to be more specific, Jack Zduriencik. (In fact one of those reporters, Jon Morosi, talked to 710 ESPN Seattle's "Danny, Dave and Moore" about that very issue on Monday.)
Jack Zduriencik is tough to deal with. He's tough to make a deal with. I'm not saying that the claims are without merit, but we've heard this before, yet Zduriencik continues to make deals – lots of deals, and more than most teams in baseball. Until somebody, heck a number of somebodies, come out and say they flat-out won't deal with him, I really don't care. Until I know (and this won't happen) just what has been on the table and what other clubs have been willing to do I can't even make an evaluation of the situation. Zduriencik is not a pushover? Great.
Now there is talk of indecisiveness, and this is another matter if it is truly the case. But who is to say, other than the rival executive who has a measure of motive, that this is indecisiveness rather than strategy? No, I chalk this up to "Mariners must trade Felix" type content this time of the year and file it away rather than put too much stock into it.

 

[wazzu31]

Weird article... First i hate unnamed sources....if your gonna say it own it, if not shut your mouth

With that said, i don't hate it. I mean jack z is tryng to acquire talent and give up as little as possible. Would we rather the same unnamed gutless sources say, man jack z that guy is who you wanna go to when you need to pull a bavasi? Sounds like these gms want to eff us and have jack z pay the bar tab if you get what im saying.....

If guys are in charge or in the front office's of other teams they have to stay anonymous if they give any interview even slightly being negative towards another member of another front office. One of the jobs of a GM is to network with other GM's or front offices. Getting blacklisted by your other brethren of GM's is worse than a GM who makes 309 thousand Doug Fister trades.

 

[wazzu31]

And I get the "grade scale" which has been my biggest pet peeves of Jack from every deal after the Cliff Lee deal. Outside of that one deal, he has yet to make a trade that has had the Mariners ahead in value. The Capps for Morrison is the closest I can think and Morrison had already busted at the MLB level, Capps struggled was also hurt and it was obvious he was called up to early.

If he is actually grading, then he is only thinking about dealing type A or B prospects instead of looking what the team needs.

He doesn't have to go for 1 big splash, but possibly 2 minor ones with C grades by using some lesser quality prospects and possibly some bullpen arms.

Personally I'm not against dealing Rodney for a hitter. One thing that has been a constant under Jack's tenure is that they can always just stick a guy in at closer and he does well.

 

[AceKeptic]

The title of this thread should be changed to "Gee, I'm sick of Z!"

Just as well, as he can only watch as this team tanks.