Series Thread: 2nd Round: Houston Rockets vs San Antonio Spurs

[bksballer89]

I don't see the Spurs having much of a chance vs the Warriors... They're gonna have to kill the clock and play 90's Utah Jazz basketball if they want any kinda chance...

Changing your philosophy after 94 games (not including the preseason) is borderline retarded.

 

[gordontrue]

Harden has been getting more consistent help from his teammates than Kawhi has.

Rockets in 7.

 

[trojanfan12]

Who said that?

Harden sucking is just the bigger story here. Sure SA was great and they defended him extremely well. But, not THAT well.

I don't think anyone said it directly, but with all of the focus being on how bad the Rockets played, it implies that it was just about how bad Harden and the Rockets sucked, not how good the Spurs were.

Also, they did play THAT well. You know as well as I do that good, well played defense doesn't necessarily mean that defenders are hounding a guy every second of the game. Good defense keeps the opponent out of their offensive rhythm and forces them into situations they aren't as comfortable with. That way, on those plays where the defense doesn't quite get there, the opponent still misses shots because he's out of his rhythm and/or not getting the shots he's used to from the spots he's used to getting them.

Obviously, when a team loses by 40, they have contributed to their own demise by not responding well. But for the media to make it all about the Rockets and Harden playing bad is to discount how well the Spurs played.

 

[DorianRo]

Give the freaking Spurs some credit.
Why does it always have to be about their opponents playing poorly.

They won 61 games.
They won the season series.
They had the series lead (3-2)
They have completely and utterly dominated Mike Dantoni teams in the playoffs.
They have 21 consecutive 50 win seasons and the best coach in the game.
They havent finished lower than 2nd place since Doctor J was still in the league with a full Spurs roster.
They have more titles (5) than non-playoff seasons (4) in their entire franchise history.

But, it is all about James Harden??

Yes, he sucked. But SA played awesome as well.

Its more about the Rockets and Harden going MIA in an elimination game when having an MVP season. MVP players don't disappear in Elimination games. And Spurs missing Parker/Leonard. No excuse for Houston to get whipped at home. Not when SA is missing 2 keys guys (one being their best player) on the road.

Rockets should have easily won this game. Not get their asses torn apart.

This was just all about effort. The Spurs wanted it. The Rockets were asleep from tip-off

 

[gordontrue]

It's really weird that the Spurs defense has been consistently better with Kawhi on the bench this year. I'm sure there's an explanation, cause he's clearly an elite defender - but there's something going on from a team dynamic. My first reaction is to suggest that this is because the Spurs bench players are better defensively than the rest of the Spurs starters (which I think is true)... but even if you look at Kawhi's DPM (which accounts for who he gets his minutes with), there's still a huge drop off defensively from past years. Something is up.


This shows ON-OFF defensive ratings for some of the better defenders in the league. As expected, the teams play much better defense with their best defender on the floor... except for the Spurs. They play much better defense with their best defender on the bench.

 

[trojanfan12]

It's really weird that the Spurs defense has been consistently better with Kawhi on the bench this year. I'm sure there's an explanation, cause he's clearly an elite defender - but there's something going on from a team dynamic. My first reaction is to suggest that this is because the Spurs bench players are better defensively than the rest of the Spurs starters (which I think is true)... but even if you look at Kawhi's DPM (which accounts for who he gets his minutes with), there's still a huge drop off defensively from past years. Something is up.


This shows ON-OFF defensive ratings for some of the better defenders in the league. As expected, the teams play much better defense with their best defender on the floor... except for the Spurs. They play much better defense with their best defender on the bench.

View attachment 159668

It may actually have something to with how good he is defensively believe it or not. When he's on the floor, the other 4 guys may tend to relax a bit defensively knowing that Kawhi is there to cover up for them.

Plus, with the exception of Lebron, the other guys listed are centers or power forwards, while Kawhi is a perimeter player. While the Spurs bigs are good, they aren't exactly great rim protectors. So, you end up with guys getting easier shots.

And even in comparison to Lebron. Lebron is big enough that he can defend all 5 positions when necessary. Kawhi isn't.

 

[gordontrue]

It may actually have something to with how good he is defensively believe it or not. When he's on the floor, the other 4 guys may tend to relax a bit defensively knowing that Kawhi is there to cover up for them.

Plus, with the exception of Lebron, the other guys listed are centers or power forwards, while Kawhi is a perimeter player. While the Spurs bigs are good, they aren't exactly great rim protectors. So, you end up with guys getting easier shots.

And even in comparison to Lebron. Lebron is big enough that he can defend all 5 positions when necessary. Kawhi isn't.

Those are some really good points.

 

[LAD]

There are a few on here. I am a little surprised an OKC fan would take that position however.

that he wouldn't know that Harden was traded. I understand that a fan doesn't follow the details of every player on the team, but he was their 6th man so would've made sense to follow HIM.

 

[Shanemansj13]

It's really weird that the Spurs defense has been consistently better with Kawhi on the bench this year. I'm sure there's an explanation, cause he's clearly an elite defender - but there's something going on from a team dynamic. My first reaction is to suggest that this is because the Spurs bench players are better defensively than the rest of the Spurs starters (which I think is true)... but even if you look at Kawhi's DPM (which accounts for who he gets his minutes with), there's still a huge drop off defensively from past years. Something is up.


This shows ON-OFF defensive ratings for some of the better defenders in the league. As expected, the teams play much better defense with their best defender on the floor... except for the Spurs. They play much better defense with their best defender on the bench.

View attachment 159668

Wow. Look at Lebron's Truly says how much he means to this defense or the team defense

 

[tlance]

I don't think anyone said it directly, but with all of the focus being on how bad the Rockets played, it implies that it was just about how bad Harden and the Rockets sucked, not how good the Spurs were.

Also, they did play THAT well. You know as well as I do that good, well played defense doesn't necessarily mean that defenders are hounding a guy every second of the game. Good defense keeps the opponent out of their offensive rhythm and forces them into situations they aren't as comfortable with. That way, on those plays where the defense doesn't quite get there, the opponent still misses shots because he's out of his rhythm and/or not getting the shots he's used to from the spots he's used to getting them.

Obviously, when a team loses by 40, they have contributed to their own demise by not responding well. But for the media to make it all about the Rockets and Harden playing bad is to discount how well the Spurs played.

I am not trying to take away from the SA defense, but defense alone does not explain 10 points on 2-11 with 7 assists and 6 TOs.

Harden looked lethargic. He was passive. In the first half, he passed up open shot opportunities to swing the ball to guarded teammates. I have never seen a star play that way. He looked like a player with no confidence. Since he had been torching the Spurs for the first 4.5 games, it makes no sense.

The only thing I can figure is physical exhaustion. Harden typically expends very little energy defensively, but D'Antoni asked him to defend guys like Gasol and Lee when they went super small. Wrestling with Pau may have taken his legs away. That is the only plausible explanation I can think of.

 

[boogiewithstu2007]

Changing your philosophy after 94 games (not including the preseason) is borderline retarded.

No it's not bro, you can make adjustments in basketball, You sound like George Karl right now... Making adjustments is not changing your entire philosophy....

 

[DorianRo]

James Harden hits the club after Houston's season-ending, 39-point loss

 

[trojanfan12]

I am not trying to take away from the SA defense, but defense alone does not explain 10 points on 2-11 with 7 assists and 6 TOs.

See, I'm not sure I agree. I think defense could very well be the reason. I'm not saying it's necessarily the sole reason. I've played, coached and watched enough basketball to know that sometimes, the ball just won't go down. You can shoot 10 shots and hit 7 of them, then come out the next day, shoot the same 10 shots and miss 7 of them. But the media didn't seem interested in giving any credit to the Spurs defense.

Harden looked lethargic. He was passive. In the first half, he passed up open shot opportunities to swing the ball to guarded teammates. I have never seen a star play that way. He looked like a player with no confidence. Since he had been torching the Spurs for the first 4.5 games, it makes no sense.

Honestly, I thought he looked confused, then I thought he looked like he accepted his fate. I don't want to say he quit, but he definitely looked like he couldn't wait for the game to be over. Great defense can do that. I do agree though, whatever the cause, I've never seen a star look like Harden did last night. Most would try to figure out some other way to help the team. He looked like he didn't know what the hell to do.

The only thing I can figure is physical exhaustion. Harden typically expends very little energy defensively, but D'Antoni asked him to defend guys like Gasol and Lee when they went super small. Wrestling with Pau may have taken his legs away. That is the only plausible explanation I can think of.

Maybe. He said that wasn't the case. But he may have just not been wanting to be accused of making excuses.