Possible Draft Scenario

[RaidaDave]

Possible draft as it stands now:
1. Kevin White; WR; West Virginia
2. Denzel Perryman; LB; Miami
3. Trey Flowers; DE; Arkansas
4. Andy Gallick; C; Boston College
5. Eric Rowe; CB; Utah
6. Karlos Williams; RB; Florida St.
7. Eric Dargan; S; Oregon



Possible Draft with Trade with Cleveland: (both of their 1sts, their second, and their third)
1. (a) Danny Shelton; DT; Washington
1. (b) Dorial Green-Beckham
2. (a) Owamagbe Odighizuwa; DE; UCLA
2. (b) Eric Kendricks; LB; UCLA
3. (a) Hroniss Grasu; C; Oregon
3. (b) Jalen Collins; CB; LSU
4. Ty Montgomery; WR; Stanford
5. Corey Crawford; DE; Clemson
6. Karlos Williams; RB; Florida State
7. Eric Dargan; S; Oregon

 

[cdumler7]

Very interesting Mocks. I like the picks in both. I would say the 1st one is the safer of the two as I think the 1st 5 rounds are all quality guys with very few red flags. I think rounds 1, 2, 4 could be starters in year 1 or 2. Rowe is an interesting prospect as he has started at both safety and corner and done well at both so he could definitely find an early role filling in wherever there is a need. Flowers looks more like a rotational guy than an every down starter but hard worker with good NFL frame.

The 2nd draft is one that could be big time hit or big time fail. Shelton is a guy that I wouldn't mind for the Broncos but he won't make it to us. The big issue is how much playing time can you get out of him as he does have some endurance concerns. He could though be one of the most dominating players in this entire draft. Same with DBG in he could be a top-5 WR or he could be out of the league in 3-years. Hard to tell. Owamagbe is a 1st round talent but is falling some because of some major red flags for injuries. Again another risky pick but one that could pay off big time in round 2. Kendricks and Grasu seem like the safest picks as both are high motor high quality players that I think translate well to the NFL. Very nice choices. Collins is a guy that is a bit of a developmental project but he has all the tools needed but maybe needs a year of learning before actually starting. Montgomery is a big time special teams guy with a little value as a receiver. He is not what I would call a natural receiver using more his body to catch the ball than his hands and doesn't run the best of routes but definitely a nice add as he can help in 2 of the 3 parts of a team. Don't know much about the other guys so won't pretend to.

Again very interesting drafts and both that could set the franchise up for years.

 

[BeaverShaver]

Amari Cooper?

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Those are really good mock drafts RaidaDave.. I would be happy with those players..
But my mock would have Cooper at 1 and Gurley at 2.. And take the rest of your mock.. Good mock drafts either way..

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Seems like every time they talk about White on TV, the first thing and pretty much the only thing they talk about is his combine numbers.. White's a combine freak is all they say, i don't like that!! And when they talk about Cooper, it's always PURE WR, smooth, Polish, NFL Ready, etc.. The Hype monsters on TV like White!! The EX Coaches and GM's on TV all like Cooper, so it seems.. Just some things that make you go Hmmmmm..

 

[cdumler7]

Seems like every time they talk about White on TV, the first thing and pretty much the only thing they talk about is his combine numbers.. White's a combine freak is all they say, i don't like that!! And when they talk about Cooper, it's always PURE WR, smooth, Polish, NFL Ready, etc.. The Hype monsters on TV like White!! The EX Coaches and GM's on TV all like Cooper, so it seems.. Just some things that make you go Hmmmmm..

Well if all they can talk about with White is his combine numbers then they really should take some time to watch his film because he is a pretty darn good receiver on top of having great combine numbers. Obviously he didn't put up the numbers that Cooper did this past year but he also didn't have the quarterback or team around him that Cooper did either. Individually though he showed that the speed he showed at the combine is not just combine speed but that is how he plays the game as well. He is a big strong receiver that does have some negatives such as really didn't run the full route tree like that of Cooper so White will take some time to develop. Cooper is the guy I actually expect to have the better rookie season (unless he goes to a team with a terrible quarterback situation). The issue is which one long-term do you see being the better receiver? At this point hard to tell.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Oh do

Well if all they can talk about with White is his combine numbers then they really should take some time to watch his film because he is a pretty darn good receiver on top of having great combine numbers. Obviously he didn't put up the numbers that Cooper did this past year but he also didn't have the quarterback or team around him that Cooper did either. Individually though he showed that the speed he showed at the combine is not just combine speed but that is how he plays the game as well. He is a big strong receiver that does have some negatives such as really didn't run the full route tree like that of Cooper so White will take some time to develop. Cooper is the guy I actually expect to have the better rookie season (unless he goes to a team with a terrible quarterback situation). The issue is which one long-term do you see being the better receiver? At this point hard to tell.

Oh don't get me wrong dude, he is good.. I just want them to tell us why White is the better PURE WR than Cooper.. Cuz the tape don't show that.. When they say combine freak, it's a turn off!! When the game is on the line?? BIG 3-8 who makes that catch?? We all know who.. I want now, not years from now.. Heck Coop is only 20, so his future ain't even here yet..

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

So the Raiders cut Branch eh?? Good luck Branch!! We NEED to lock up Ross!!

 

[cdumler7]

Oh do

Oh don't get me wrong dude, he is good.. I just want them to tell us why White is the better PURE WR than Cooper.. Cuz the tape don't show that.. When they say combine freak, it's a turn off!! When the game is on the line?? BIG 3-8 who makes that catch?? We all know who.. I want now, not years from now.. Heck Coop is only 20, so his future ain't even here yet..

You have to remember the draft is not always about who is most productive but who do you think will have the better career in the pros. A great example is numbers wise RGIII outplayed Luck by quite a bit in college. When looking at future potential in the pros though it was an easy choice between the two. Throw in throughout the years there have been plenty of WR's that have been very productive in college partly because of the system installed.

So Idaho you have to look at a lot of different things. Heck two of the three best receivers in the NFL came from a triple option offense in Georgia Tech with Calvin Johnson and D. Thomas. They essentially ran about 2 routes throughout college and that was it yet now they are tearing the NFL up.

Now who is better of Cooper and White well only God knows at this time. They both have there positives that are hard to overlook. I also don't think this is one of those situations of one will fail and the other will succeed. I think both will find quite a bit of success in the NFL.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

You have to remember the draft is not always about who is most productive but who do you think will have the better career in the pros. A great example is numbers wise RGIII outplayed Luck by quite a bit in college. When looking at future potential in the pros though it was an easy choice between the two. Throw in throughout the years there have been plenty of WR's that have been very productive in college partly because of the system installed.

So Idaho you have to look at a lot of different things. Heck two of the three best receivers in the NFL came from a triple option offense in Georgia Tech with Calvin Johnson and D. Thomas. They essentially ran about 2 routes throughout college and that was it yet now they are tearing the NFL up.

Now who is better of Cooper and White well only God knows at this time. They both have there positives that are hard to overlook. I also don't think this is one of those situations of one will fail and the other will succeed. I think both will find quite a bit of success in the NFL.

I get what ya saying dude.. And i never bought the hype, that RG3 was better than Luck.. The tape said Luck was the better player.. ESPN, NFL Network are in the business of selling hype, highlights.. So this Cooper White debate reminds me of just that.. Cooper= Luck and White =RG3.. Pop the tape in, and Coop is the better player.. But the TV that sells hype and highlights is saying White.. Again, i think White is good, and would be happy with him.. But the tape says Coop is better.. RG3 got ALL the love and hype, but who turned out better?? You are right cd, in that NOBODY knows who will be better.. All you can go by is the tape.. Not the hype or highlights.. Again, if we take White?? Amari who?? Cuz that's how i roll..

 

[cdumler7]

See for me Idaho this is one of those situations I honestly do think both will be good. Who will be better is up for debate for sure but both have some good tape and both did well at the combine. I am with you in I am usually a tape kind of guy over what they do at the combine. I am not big on the guys who sky rocket up draft boards just because they ran a fast 40. Kind of like the Corner who set the world record in the broad jump...He was I think a 3rd round prospect before that and now they are talking 1st round. Well if his tape says 3rd round then to me he should stay a 3rd round kind of guy. I know coaches get caught up in the if they have freakish athletic ability that you can coach the rest of it up kind of thing but there still has to be a foundation of actual football ability to go with that freakish athletic ability.

Again though this is one of those situations where both have good to great tape and both showed that what they put on tape is not a fluke college thing with how they did at the combine. I don't think that Raiders could go wrong with either. I do lean towards White as he doesn't have as good of tape as Cooper but he has good enough tape along with freakish athletic ability to leave me thinking he has the higher upside of the two. At the same time either one the Raiders pick I will be going "oh crap now we have to cover this guy for the next 10 years."

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

I agree, both could be real good.. I just see Cooper as a 20 Year old that can run the whole tree dude, explosive, monster size hands!! Polished, Pro Ready.. Whens the last time you seen that?? Very Rare.. Chain mover, its not all about the big play.. Game on the line who makes the clutch catch?? Our season rests on the arm of Carr!!
I want to get him a WR that's always open, that can line up anywhere.. Again, i like White alot!! But he can't RUN with Amari bro.. Cooper will KILL ya everywhere!! Tim Brown Jerry Rice are some guys i would compare Cooper too.. White is more like AJ from Houston.. Can't go wrong either way..

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

I agree, both could be real good.. I just see Cooper as a 20 Year old that can run the whole tree dude, explosive, monster size hands!! Polished, Pro Ready.. Whens the last time you seen that?? Very Rare.. Chain mover, its not all about the big play.. Game on the line who makes the clutch catch?? Our season rests on the arm of Carr!!
I want to get him a WR that's always open, that can line up anywhere.. Again, i like White alot!! But he can't RUN with Amari bro.. Cooper will KILL ya everywhere!! Tim Brown Jerry Rice are some guys i would compare Cooper too.. White is more like AJ from Houston.. Can't go wrong either way..

With you being a former WR.. Im sort of shocked you would lean White over Coop, with everything Coop brings to the table.. Heck who knows, we could pass on WR and take some D player..

 

[cdumler7]

Haha yeah honestly my game was a lot more like that of Cooper compared to White. I always got so pisssed at the guys that were 6'3" who just had it so much easier in some ways as a WR but honestly they never took advantage of their God Given skills. I was the work horse that was taught from age 10 that you win with having the best technique and that is what I did. You might be convincing me of Cooper now just by saying that and me remembering how much harder guys with great technique seem to work at their job. Guys like White do seem to just have the game handed to them of being big and fast and don't always work at their craft.

I do like your comparisons though as White does remind me of Andre Johnson quite a bit. Great player who just never quite got the chance with a great quarterback to really show off his full skills. Cooper reminds me a lot more of a bigger Wes Welker in his prime. The guy has a great cut move that very few defenders can stay with. Cooper offers more in the deep ball game and around the goal line but between the 20's his quick footwork will definitely have him beating just about anyone 1-on-1. I guess the big thing I like about White beyond the speed is I do think he offers a bit more around the goal line than that of Cooper. He is the guy that more times than not wins the jump ball and has the stronger hands of the two to win the catches in traffic. I would say watching his games he reminds me a bit of Boldin for the 49ers with just the catches he makes even when covered. Again I really like both of them and like I said you might be convincing me of Cooper just because he reminds me of myself.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Haha yeah honestly my game was a lot more like that of Cooper compared to White. I always got so pisssed at the guys that were 6'3" who just had it so much easier in some ways as a WR but honestly they never took advantage of their God Given skills. I was the work horse that was taught from age 10 that you win with having the best technique and that is what I did. You might be convincing me of Cooper now just by saying that and me remembering how much harder guys with great technique seem to work at their job. Guys like White do seem to just have the game handed to them of being big and fast and don't always work at their craft.

I do like your comparisons though as White does remind me of Andre Johnson quite a bit. Great player who just never quite got the chance with a great quarterback to really show off his full skills. Cooper reminds me a lot more of a bigger Wes Welker in his prime. The guy has a great cut move that very few defenders can stay with. Cooper offers more in the deep ball game and around the goal line but between the 20's his quick footwork will definitely have him beating just about anyone 1-on-1. I guess the big thing I like about White beyond the speed is I do think he offers a bit more around the goal line than that of Cooper. He is the guy that more times than not wins the jump ball and has the stronger hands of the two to win the catches in traffic. I would say watching his games he reminds me a bit of Boldin for the 49ers with just the catches he makes even when covered. Again I really like both of them and like I said you might be convincing me of Cooper just because he reminds me of myself.

Right on cd.. i bet you were pretty good.. And size is not everything in the NFL.. Cat's like Welker and all those small guys the Pats have would carve your heart out.. Heck Coop has good size.. 6-1 210 is good size.. PlayMakers is what matters not size.. Game on the line, that's what matters!! Clutch, Crunch time baby!! Come get some!! That's how i see Coop.. Is that the kind of player you were?? If so?? BadAzz!!

 

[cdumler7]

Right on cd.. i bet you were pretty good.. And size is not everything in the NFL.. Cat's like Welker and all those small guys the Pats have would carve your heart out.. Heck Coop has good size.. 6-1 210 is good size.. PlayMakers is what matters not size.. Game on the line, that's what matters!! Clutch, Crunch time baby!! Come get some!! That's how i see Coop.. Is that the kind of player you were?? If so?? BadAzz!!

Appreciate the thought. I never was going to go pro but I definitely worked my tail off and made a few plays here and there. You are right those quick guys can do some real damage and coops speed to size ratio is off the charts! He is going to leave some guys flat on their backs wondering where he went. What FA's you looking at here in a week for the Raiders to sign?

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Appreciate the thought. I never was going to go pro but I definitely worked my tail off and made a few plays here and there. You are right those quick guys can do some real damage and coops speed to size ratio is off the charts! He is going to leave some guys flat on their backs wondering where he went. What FA's you looking at here in a week for the Raiders to sign?

Its not about going PRO.. Its all about holding your OWN.. That= BadAzz!! And Yup Coop is going to break ankles!!
And who do i want in FA?? Shoot dude the team you cheer for has some of the best on the market.. I also like Suh, Hardy, Cobb, Maclin, JPP, Hughs, man the list is long bro.. Best FA class EVER and deep..

 

[DJ]

White over Cooper?


























Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

White over Cooper?


























Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?

Pretty nuts if you ask me DJ..

 

[DJ]

And Winston isn't listed in the top 7......despite a pretty good showing at the Combine.