JULY 30-31 Rangers @ Arizona.

[saddles]

It is easy to judge the results after the fact.

Very true. To be fair you really have to look at the trade now and say "should they have done this or not." I have liked trades that turned out to be awful. It wouldn't have been fair for me to turn around later and then complain about it when things didn't work out. Sometimes there are important facts that come out later that may make it fair to change your mind later. The fact that Prince Firlder's bat speed had decreased the year before we traded for him wasn't known to a lot of fans when the trade was made so any who changed their mind about that trade were certainly justified.

I just don't think it is right to wait and see how the players perform to judge a trade. On the other hand, it is very fair to judge our developmental process by how these guys play in the future.

One thing I really don't understand is for someone to tell you it us too early to judge a trade when it happens and then turn around and say you are using hindsight when you complain about the trade again when it doesn't work out. lol. In other words, you never should dislike a trade is what they really mean.

 

[WastinSomeTime]

Very true. To be fair you really have to look at the trade now and say "should they have done this or not." I have liked trades that turned out to be awful. It wouldn't have been fair for me to turn around later and then complain about it when things didn't work out. Sometimes there are important facts that come out later that may make it fair to change your mind later. The fact that Prince Firlder's bat speed had decreased the year before we traded for him wasn't known to a lot of fans when the trade was made so any who changed their mind about that trade were certainly justified.

I just don't think it is right to wait and see how the players perform to judge a trade. On the other hand, it is very fair to judge our developmental process by how these guys play in the future.

One thing I really don't understand is for someone to tell you it us too early to judege a trade when it happens and then turn around and say you are using hindsight when you complain about the trade again when it doesn't work out. lol. In other words, you never should dislike a trade is what they really mean.

My feelings is in this trade it is really hard for me to see jumping on board and saying we got the best end of the bargain. I just hope this guy turns out to be a SP for us a few years down the road. But all trades are like a roll of the dice. You just hope your roll 7's. But you are right in that if it turns sour to me you really can kick JD in the butt because he is basing what he did on the information given him and rolling his dice.

 

[BULLPEN FAILURE]

Worth checking out: A few thoughts on the Keone Kela trade

I agree, in fact that's why I posted it 30 minutes earlier! LOL

 

[BULLPEN FAILURE]

Inside the difficult reality the Rangers faced when they dealt Keone Kela to the Pirates

Decent synopsis of all the moving parts that need to be considered when trading players.

 

[Kelleyman]

Very true. To be fair you really have to look at the trade now and say "should they have done this or not." I have liked trades that turned out to be awful. It wouldn't have been fair for me to turn around later and then complain about it when things didn't work out. Sometimes there are important facts that come out later that may make it fair to change your mind later. The fact that Prince Firlder's bat speed had decreased the year before we traded for him wasn't known to a lot of fans when the trade was made so any who changed their mind about that trade were certainly justified.

I just don't think it is right to wait and see how the players perform to judge a trade. On the other hand, it is very fair to judge our developmental process by how these guys play in the future.

One thing I really don't understand is for someone to tell you it us too early to judge a trade when it happens and then turn around and say you are using hindsight when you complain about the trade again when it doesn't work out. lol. In other words, you never should dislike a trade is what they really mean.

I think we hope we have a SP. No guarantees and LSB another too keen.

Major thought is deferring talent base.

The judgement on us not developing starting pitchers in abundance minus those we have traded is a fair assessment unfortunately.

 

[Kelleyman]

Re judging trades/PF. Interesting topic

I thought the rationale for getting PF was ok at the time although prior to that I did want us to get Abreu. We had Profar blocked by Kinsler and a need for a LH power bat in ballpark oneself noted for jet stream. Of course doing the physicals which were not down routinely was not done. Some thought Kinsler was overpaid

Now looking at it PF was damaged and Kinsler did not regress defensively nor offensively as thought and Profar damaged too. Just a very unfortunate trade overall. We have never gotten it straight in LF since

The logic all looked good to me but obviously it was not good

 

[saddles]

Re judging trades/PF. Interesting topic

I thought the rationale for getting PF was ok at the time although prior to that I did want us to get Abreu. We had Profar blocked by Kinsler and a need for a LH power bat in ballpark oneself noted for jet stream. Of course doing the physicals which were not down routinely was not done. Some thought Kinsler was overpaid

Now looking at it PF was damaged and Kinsler did not regress defensively nor offensively as thought and Profar damaged too. Just a very unfortunate trade overall. We have never gotten it straight in LF since

The logic all looked good to me but obviously it was not good

I wouldn't have minded trading Ian for prospects. I thought Prince was overoaid when he signed with the Tigers and that was before his bat speed decreased. That trade was a very unwise move to me and it looked even worse when Fraley reported what scouts already knew.

 

[PhantomWarrior]

Right and I mentioned that even though some project because of his lack of a 3rd pitch and control he may end up as a reliever.

Just what we need...another reliever.

 

[BULLPEN FAILURE]

 

[WastinSomeTime]

I agree, in fact that's why I posted it 30 minutes earlier! LOL

Hahaha! Missed that one.

 

[PhantomWarrior]

On the other hand, it is very fair to judge our developmental process by how these guys play in the future.

Excellent point. We have not been very good developing starters in the past and present and what makes us think we can take a guy who still needs work on his secondary pitches and make him a starter. We seem to have a host of guys who can throw hard and maybe one other pitch developed. But given Kela is a risk for the Pirates (previous injuries), this may just be two teams taking some risk.

 

[Kelleyman]

Re Hearn slider. On Athletic so subscription may be needed unless unlocked. He thinks he can perfect his slider which will allow him to be a starter

 

[DT LUNA]

Two hours and counting.

 

[Nightcrawler]

Where’s diekman going to go?

 

[BULLPEN FAILURE]

 

[DT LUNA]

Where’s diekman going to go?

He has 1 hr 20 min to figure it out.

 

[DT LUNA]

He has 1 hr 20 min to figure it out.

UPDATE: 1 hr

 

[WastinSomeTime]

Looks like the Phils are getting Wilson Ramos. I guess when he comes back from the DL Alfaro will be watching most of the games. Kind of pulling for Gabe Kapler.

 

[BULLPEN FAILURE]

 

[WastinSomeTime]

I kind of would like for him to retire and for us to move on with the rebuild and let the young guys play. This way Profar and IKF get more opportunities. But I will miss him.