Another year?....or....Does Allen go with his Tampa team?

[Stymietee]

Jay Gruden is the key here, if he decides to truly build this team to his liking, he's got to be brave enough to cut ties with the ole' Tampa team and Jim Hazlet his friend and mentor. If he is unable to muster the courage to do this, then Bruce Allen must. That is step one. Step two is a bit more complicated and begins in the office of Daniel Snyder, who, must instruct Allen to relinquish the title of GM, hire a veteran well respected dedicated GM with the charge and resources to upgrade the entire scouting department. Here's where it gets tricky, If Allen who does a very good job with cap issues and contracts is unwilling to accept these changes, Snyder must cut ties with him.

 

[Sportster 72]

Sty, this a great idea but it goes against everything Snyder stands for. Dan has always surrounded himself with yes men that do his bidding. This doesn't just pertain to football but everything Dan does in life. You are asking the man to do something he has never done.

 

[j_y19]

I agree Sportster. Dan isn't making that move. The best we can hope for is that Allen realizes they need better talent evaluators and they somehow find a way to nab a new Director of Scouting from a team that has a proven track record of landing talent.

To be fair, we haven't really had any draft pics for a couple of years. Between the cap penalty and the pics we gave up for Robert, our cupboard has been bare. This will be the first year in quite a few that we approach the off season with a full compliment of cap space and picks.

The interesting first moves to expect is who we release before FA to make cap space room. Bowen, Chester, Clark, and maybe even Hatcher should be givens. We also have a couple of our own FAs that we need to figure out if we want to keep. Helu, Rak, McCoy have to be the most prominent. All 3 may be leaving.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

Jay Gruden is the key here, if he decides to truly build this team to his liking, he's got to be brave enough to cut ties with the ole' Tampa team and Jim Hazlet his friend and mentor. If he is unable to muster the courage to do this, then Bruce Allen must. That is step one. Step two is a bit more complicated and begins in the office of Daniel Snyder, who, must instruct Allen to relinquish the title of GM, hire a veteran well respected dedicated GM with the charge and resources to upgrade the entire scouting department. Here's where it gets tricky, If Allen who does a very good job with cap issues and contracts is unwilling to accept these changes, Snyder must cut ties with him.

You do realize that if Gruden is to build "this team to his liking" that it most likely means using his system & likely moving on without RG3 - right? That is contrary to the other thread that you created. I am not advocating any approach & see some merit in both of your suggestions. However - being patient & sticking with RG3 for a few more seasons regardless of results may be alright for some but certainly not for a new head coach. Someone in that position cannot afford to be too patient at the risk of losing their job.

Also - let's say that Snyder cuts ties with Allen - what then? There is no guarantee that he will subsequently hire someone else who will do a good job. There is a strong possibility that he hires some puppet who does worse. People need to understand that when they make various suggestions they are looking it at from their own perspective. This is not reality.

You need to view this from Snyder's perspective (sadly). When viewing things in this manner the only thing that really matters is whether Snyder starts to finally handle this correctly. Otherwise - the only hope is that the Redskins are extremely lucky for the next 5+ years.

 

[skinsdad62]

did you all hate the last draft that we had ?

were roberts and DJAX POS pick -ups ?

look no matter what i say about snyder and how he is involved in team decisions you wont buy it

but some of you guys forget that for 4 years before snyder we sucked as well

what GM with any credibility would take this job if you cut ties with allen after one year as GM , the real GM?

and what GM are you gunning for ? give me a few names

you want new directors of pro scouting / scouts , then give me some names

its all fine and dandy to ID a problem but what good is that if you dont come to the table with a solution that is viable

 

[SoCalWizFan]

did you all hate the last draft that we had ?

were roberts and DJAX POS pick -ups ?

look no matter what i say about snyder and how he is involved in team decisions you wont buy it

but some of you guys forget that for 4 years before snyder we sucked as well

what GM with any credibility would take this job if you cut ties with allen after one year as GM , the real GM?

and what GM are you gunning for ? give me a few names

you want new directors of pro scouting / scouts , then give me some names

its all fine and dandy to ID a problem but what good is that if you dont come to the table with a solution that is viable

I am fine with maintaining Allen, Gruden, etc next season, and they pretty much have to go that route or be ridiculed even more. However - I would like to see a true spokesperson for this organization - either Snyder or Allen - address the media and fans just after the season & lay everything out on the table. Admit that the organization has failed the fans miserably & that they will do everything possible to correct the situation by taking a well thought out approach to bring back the success that some of us knew in the past.

I am sick of Gruden & the players having to take the blame for everything while the folks running the show are nowhere to be found.

 

[skinsdad62]

I am fine with maintaining Allen, Gruden, etc next season, and they pretty much have to go that route or be ridiculed even more. However - I would like to see a true spokesperson for this organization - either Snyder or Allen - address the media and fans just after the season & lay everything out on the table. Admit that the organization has failed the fans miserably & that they will do everything possible to correct the situation by taking a well thought out approach to bring back the success that some of us knew in the past.

I am sick of Gruden & the players having to take the blame for everything while the folks running the show are nowhere to be found.

check my mock off season thread . you may like it

 

[Stymietee]

You do realize that if Gruden is to build "this team to his liking" that it most likely means using his system & likely moving on without RG3 - right? That is contrary to the other thread that you created. I am not advocating any approach & see some merit in both of your suggestions. However - being patient & sticking with RG3 for a few more seasons regardless of results may be alright for some but certainly not for a new head coach. Someone in that position cannot afford to be too patient at the risk of losing their job.

Also - let's say that Snyder cuts ties with Allen - what then? There is no guarantee that he will subsequently hire someone else who will do a good job. There is a strong possibility that he hires some puppet who does worse. People need to understand that when they make various suggestions they are looking it at from their own perspective. This is not reality.

You need to view this from Snyder's perspective (sadly). When viewing things in this manner the only thing that really matters is whether Snyder starts to finally handle this correctly. Otherwise - the only hope is that the Redskins are extremely lucky for the next 5+ years.

While I do appreciate your points, the flaw comes when you state that Gruden's system would be run without RGIII.I absolutely DO NOT agree with this position! The point of the other thread was NOT to bench RGIII as a prerequisite toward releasing or trading him, but rather to protect him from further harm that comes with putting him in an unfamiliar position with an eye towards teaching him to play the game in a manner that best fits his system. This makes my two posts consistent with one another.

Second point....It would not be Snyder who cut ties with Allen but Allen who resigns because his ego does not have space for the truthful evaluation of his skillset. Don't believe me...just understand that when the time came for the appointment of a GM, Allen did not defer and say my job as president dealing with contracts, cap issues, and public relations fills my plate.....instead.....he gleefully took the post.

It is not that difficult to see things from Snyder's perspective. He's made his mark in public relations and other ventures. It will be his public relation hat that forces change on this team. Disgruntled fans, sells heading south, empty seats, irrelevance, and the ridicule of the nation and peers, will force this man to finally see the flaws in his ownership.

 

[Stymietee]

did you all hate the last draft that we had ?

were roberts and DJAX POS pick -ups ?

look no matter what i say about snyder and how he is involved in team decisions you wont buy it

but some of you guys forget that for 4 years before snyder we sucked as well

what GM with any credibility would take this job if you cut ties with allen after one year as GM , the real GM?

and what GM are you gunning for ? give me a few names

you want new directors of pro scouting / scouts , then give me some names

its all fine and dandy to ID a problem but what good is that if you dont come to the table with a solution that is viable

Let's be honest here, if you've drafted guys who are/were incapable of supplanting Polumbus or Chester, you have to question that draft class.

Secondarily, I will grant that Roberts is a good pick-up, but honestly, D.Jax was a gift from Philly, more the combination of his wanting to play within the division and available slots therein.

Next you don't cut ties with Allen, unless, his ego is too big to relinquish the GM title in favor of someone who's able to dedicate himself to the job.

GM candidates:

1. Eric DeCosta.....Baltimore Ravens

2. Eric DeCosta.....Wrote him twice because he is my #1 choice and wanted to make that clear.

3. Jason Licht.......Arizona Cardinals

4.Omar Khan........Pittsburg Steelers

5. Brian Gutekunst......G.B. Packers

6. Matt Russell........Denver Broncos

and if you add Marc Ross to the above mix any one of them would also be great Director of Scouting except Eric Decosta, who, as I've said is my #1 GM candidate.

 

[KickSaveDave]

Let's be honest here, if you've drafted guys who are/were incapable of supplanting Polumbus or Chester, you have to question that draft class.

Secondarily, I will grant that Roberts is a good pick-up, but honestly, D.Jax was a gift from Philly, more the combination of his wanting to play within the division and available slots therein.

Next you don't cut ties with Allen, unless, his ego is too big to relinquish the GM title in favor of someone who's able to dedicate himself to the job.

GM candidates:

1. Eric DeCosta.....Baltimore Ravens

2. Eric DeCosta.....Wrote him twice because he is my #1 choice and wanted to make that clear.

3. Jason Licht.......Arizona Cardinals

4.Omar Khan........Pittsburg Steelers

5. Brian Gutekunst......G.B. Packers

6. Matt Russell........Denver Broncos

and if you add Marc Ross to the above mix any one of them would also be great Director of Scouting except Eric Decosta, who, as I've said is my #1 GM candidate.

Allen should never have been given the job. His very average record in Oakland and in Tampa, let alone his time in DC with Shanny finishing last 3 out of 4 times, did not merit being given the keys to another franchise. He's a glorified football accountant, not a personnel man. He's shown zero leadership, and that's not something that one should expect to change.

Our best hope is that Snyder realizes that Allen isn't the answer and goes and gets a bonafide, quality GM. Decosta would be a fine choice. I would look hard at Mike Tannenbaum too. His work with the Jets, when compared to the hot mess before and after he was there, is almost super human. Tannenbaum cut his teeth under Belichek in Cleveland, where they build the franchise that would end up being the Ravens. I would also take a look at Brian Xanders, who built the team that Peyton Manning inherited in Denver. He's been with the Lions since 2013, and look at them today (8-4) and headed to the playoffs.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

While I do appreciate your points, the flaw comes when you state that Gruden's system would be run without RGIII.I absolutely DO NOT agree with this position! The point of the other thread was NOT to bench RGIII as a prerequisite toward releasing or trading him, but rather to protect him from further harm that comes with putting him in an unfamiliar position with an eye towards teaching him to play the game in a manner that best fits his system. This makes my two posts consistent with one another.

Second point....It would not be Snyder who cut ties with Allen but Allen who resigns because his ego does not have space for the truthful evaluation of his skillset. Don't believe me...just understand that when the time came for the appointment of a GM, Allen did not defer and say my job as president dealing with contracts, cap issues, and public relations fills my plate.....instead.....he gleefully took the post.

It is not that difficult to see things from Snyder's perspective. He's made his mark in public relations and other ventures. It will be his public relation hat that forces change on this team. Disgruntled fans, sells heading south, empty seats, irrelevance, and the ridicule of the nation and peers, will force this man to finally see the flaws in his ownership.

Huh? Who cares if Allen resigns or if he is fired. My pt is that in either situation Snyder will be the one selecting the next GM, President or whatever you want to call him & yes the successor could be much worse. Given what we have seen with this organization you would have to be pretty naive not to believe that is a possibility.

Your point about Snyder being intimidated by ridicule, empty seats, etc is laughable. All of these have already occurred numerous times over the past 10+ years & none of this has stopped the Redskins from still being very profitable. Again - you are viewing this from YOUR perspective - not Snyder's. BTW - what sales are heading south? They still have a waiting list for tickets, NFL merchandise sales are pooled so that is not really affected & you know damn well that fans will get excited and gravitate to everything Redskins come next Aug/Sept.

You need to start viewing all of this in a more realistic manner.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

Let's be honest here, if you've drafted guys who are/were incapable of supplanting Polumbus or Chester, you have to question that draft class.

How do you know that they are not capable of replacing these guys? Redskins fans also need to revise their expectations - otherwise they are not much better than Snyder. Why do so many folks believe that every single player has to be great from the moment that they take the field? If this team is ever going to be good then the team is going to have to be patient & develop players & not simply hope that they have this all-pro type draft every year.

It might sound good when folks here throw up their mock drafts & fully expect that every player from rounds 1-7 will be an all star & will contribute immediately. Guess what? That isn't reality for just about every team - even the ones that win SBs. Building an organization takes time & some of the players you mention just may surprise you in a few years.

 

[skinsdad62]

How do you know that they are not capable of replacing these guys? Redskins fans also need to revise their expectations - otherwise they are not much better than Snyder. Why do so many folks believe that every single player has to be great from the moment that they take the field? If this team is ever going to be good then the team is going to have to be patient & develop players & not simply hope that they have this all-pro type draft every year.

It might sound good when folks here throw up their mock drafts & fully expect that every player from rounds 1-7 will be an all star & will contribute immediately. Guess what? That isn't reality for just about every team - even the ones that win SBs. Building an organization takes time & some of the players you mention just may surprise you in a few years.

i am all for being patient but as much as these guys bash snyder they act like him all the time

in one post a guy bashes niles paul , a 6th round pick , for not using his wr skill at TE . HUH? this guy has more catches, yards , tds , avg per rec. then jordan reed and has been healthier and yet the time developing him is "wasted " ?

things wont get better until we have patience with our coaches , draft picks , gm's .

we have another guy bashing 2 draft picks in the 3rd round who couldnt start "right away " do you really think a 3rd round pick is typically a day one starter ? really ?