"Grumble, I don't like it!" - tOfficial VTfoozball thread

[jgHokie]

In your opinion, and yours alone, Newsome is "not as physically gifted as some of the 4 star targets".

Good thing the Tech coaching staff has a far different opinion than yours. They have done an extensive evaluation of him as a player and person, both on and off the field. I suspect that you have done neither and have no idea what you're talking about. I also suspect that you're basing your opinions on the star-evaluations of the major recruiting services, something the Tech staff doesn't use now, and has never used in the past.

Prove me wrong.

wait....so...you can't just go with what the recruiting services say?? that's absurd!! i want recievers that are 7' and run a 3.2 40 and 7 stars...anything else...GARBAGE!!!

 

[hunzworth]

How's it going over here? I have been out of town? Any issues? Everyone playing nice?

This has got to be one of the most active (non-recruiting) threads on the VT board in a while, not sure how to feel about that. but at least we argue without calling each other poo poo heads and such.

 

[Camfantasy]

This has got to be one of the most active (non-recruiting) threads on the VT board in a while, not sure how to feel about that. but at least we argue without calling each other poo poo heads and such.

You're all poo poo heads.

 

[HokieGhost]

You're all poo poo heads.

Spoken with a terrible French accent: "I fart in your general direction, I wave my genitals at your elders!"

- Monty Python and the Holy Grail, 1975

 

[Sleepy T]

This has got to be one of the most active (non-recruiting) threads on the VT board in a while, not sure how to feel about that. but at least we argue without calling each other poo poo heads and such.

Yes it has kind of taken on a life of its own...

I agree with some of what you say Foozball regarding the supposed lack of recruiting the OL and WR position (in regards to pro potential). But that is easy to say since not many of the WR and OL we have put in the league has had HUGE success. That has nothing to do with the way we have recruited them. VT has had some success in recruiting these guys, they just have not turned out to be Calvin Johnson, Sammy Watkins, Seantrel Henderson etc. VT has had its share of 4 stars in these areas and most of them have turned out to be average/above average guys. I will agree we have not had a true gamebreaker in awhile. Would love to ha ve one of them but not at the expense of drama..Some of this may have already been posted somewhere.

Eddie Royal, Todd Nolen, DJ Coles, Joel Caleb (ATH), D. Roberts (ATH)
Blake DeChristopher, Vinston Painter, Laurence Gibson, Mark Shuman,

All of these guys were 4 star guys (per Rivals). I included Caleb because it looks like he will be at WR. Some of them turned out great, some not so good, and the jury is still out on some. That is pretty well averaging a 4 star WR and a 4 star OL every other year. Not too bad, could be better, could be worse. I would argue that most of the 2-3 star guys have been better at their respective positions as a whole, certainly on OL. Ediie Royal has definetely been one of the best WR's in the past decade at VT along with Coale, Boykins, Wilford, Morgan..and others..

 

[NickVT10]

So Fooz, should we have not let Tyrod play QB even tho he was only 6'1" 200 and not 6'5" 230?
Josh Morgan was a 6'2" 3* coming out of FUMA (that is 2 extra years on the guys we are talking about right now) which still isnt that big and he is doing pretty good.

Then there is Todd Nolen, 6'3" 4.5 4* WR who did nothing. You are judging every book by the cover right now. These kids are 16 and 17 and currently Juniors in HS. He aren't proclaiming Newsome and these other guys as studs, all we are saying is we are happy to get guys who want to play for VT and will have their heart in it because those are the ones who will beat out some guy who thinks he just has to show up and he will be a star because he is a little bigger and faster.
Coaches can make players faster and stronger. They can't change what is between the ears and that is what coaches recruit. I have a friend who is a college coach and we talk recruiting a lot. They recruit guys with football IQ, guys they can fit into their system, guys who will bust their ass for them, not the biggest and fastest guys.(Vincent Painter)

You watch TV and hear these "experts" (Kiper, McShay) say that for a guy to be successful he needs to be this big, this fast, this strong. Rewatch the draft and listen to Gruden, you know the guy that was a coach and has a SB ring, and hear what he says. He is constantly talking about he doesn't care how tall a guy is or fast, he cares about how he plays the game.

 

[Taz_Hokie]

You watch TV and hear these "experts" (Kiper, McShay) say that for a guy to be successful he needs to be this big, this fast, this strong. Rewatch the draft and listen to Gruden, you know the guy that was a coach and has a SB ring, and hear what he says. He is constantly talking about he doesn't care how tall a guy is or fast, he cares about how he plays the game.

Gruden was getting a bit bitchy with Kiper and his "analysis" at this past draft. I thought it was hilarious as Kiper is such a hack.

 

[NickVT10]

The thing about Gruden is he is a football guy. He knows what a guy needs to be successful playing the game and being 2" taller or .1 seconds faster aren't the important things.

 

[sparko]

I'd argue that height means the least. Most balls thrown to a WR aren't "up for grabs" .. Having good-enough speed helps but having great hands, running great routes, and being on the same page as far as route-changes,etc with your QB (football IQ) -- those three things are far more important than height.

 

[Chrish1023]

The thing about Gruden is he is a football guy. He knows what a guy needs to be successful playing the game and being 2" taller or .1 seconds faster aren't the important things.

Yeah Kiper gets soo obnoxious. But that's what ESPN needs in the draft room: an antagonist who you love to hate. My one quip with Gruden is that he doesn't really dislike anybody. Just about every player up there he was complimentary of. Then again, from a player's perspective, I'm sure you'd much rather have that than someone up there talking shit about you.

 

[hokiegrad]

You will never see this sport completely dominated by tall WRs. I mean, to the extent that shorter guys can't get on the field. You need both. Height can be a disadvantage as much as it can be an advantage.

 

[Chrish1023]

And in regards to all this nonsense, WHAT IS THE POINT?!?! I'll admit, I'm somewhat negative about certain recruits. I wasn't impressed with Michael Holmes tape whatsoever. But if he turns out to be good, that is a perfect example of why you can't judge a player to early. You guys keep spewing out ridiculous stats about players who outperformed their measureables. While I love the Danny Coales and Cody Grimms, there are just as many (if not more) low star failures than successes.

If we get Fuller (which seems like it should happen?), we would arguably have our best class ever as is. If we get any of the other high profile targets, that combined with last year and hopefully next year, will set the stage for some REALLY good teams in the near future.

 

[bigesse16]

And in regards to all this nonsense, WHAT IS THE POINT?!?! I'll admit, I'm somewhat negative about certain recruits. I wasn't impressed with Michael Holmes tape whatsoever. But if he turns out to be good, that is a perfect example of why you can't judge a player to early. You guys keep spewing out ridiculous stats about players who outperformed their measureables. While I love the Danny Coales and Cody Grimms, there are just as many (if not more) low star failures than successes.

If we get Fuller (which seems like it should happen?), we would arguably have our best class ever as is. If we get any of the other high profile targets, that combined with last year and hopefully next year, will set the stage for some REALLY good teams in the near future.

That's our point. You can't determine how successful a prospect is going to be based on his junior year HS measurables.

 

[Chrish1023]

That's our point. You can't determine how successful a prospect is going to be based on his junior year HS measurables.

My issue was more with using players like Wes Welker and Danny Coale to prove a point. I think the phrase I'm looking for is: "there are lies, damned lies, and then there are statistics". Yes, maybe there have been a few short guys who were good. There are also plenty that didn't work out, though.

Foozball, for now, just watch their videos and base your opinion on that. I've never played so I don't know shit about technique, but if the guy is quick and always seems to be in the right position, I'd say that's a good start. Another thing that hasn't been mentioned much is reaction time. People talk about smarts, but how fast your brain reacts and subsequently, how fast your body reacts is a big deal.

 

[NickVT10]

The counter to your argument is how many Marcus Davis like athletes fizzle out as well. We just dont like fooz ripping a HS kid and saying he isnt as good as this guy when there is no way to tell until he gets on the field at VT.

 

[VTfoozball]

In your opinion, and yours alone, Newsome is "not as physically gifted as some of the 4 star targets".

Good thing the Tech coaching staff has a far different opinion than yours. They have done an extensive evaluation of him as a player and person, both on and off the field. I suspect that you have done neither and have no idea what you're talking about. I also suspect that you're basing your opinions on the star-evaluations of the major recruiting services, something the Tech staff doesn't use now, and has never used in the past.

Prove me wrong.

How many times do I have to tell you that I'm talking about players that the VT staff has already offered? That means they already have the TAHedison stamp of approval. Geez. And hell yes there are plenty of WRs across the nation that are more physically gifted than Newsome otherwise he would be a five star

 

[VTfoozball]

That's our point. You can't determine how successful a prospect is going to be based on his junior year HS measurables.

Or film evidently which is what I've looked at. I wish the coaches would set you guys straight about the players they've looked at since they have the only opinion that really matters. I'm sure they have favorites and a tiered system.

 

[HokieGhost]

How many times do I have to tell you that I'm talking about players that the VT staff has already offered? That means they already have the TAHedison stamp of approval. Geez. And hell yes there are plenty of WRs across the nation that are more physically gifted than Newsome otherwise he would be a five star

Wow. You just don't get it, do you?

According to the recruiting services "there are plenty of WRs across the nation that are more physically giftedthan Newsome otherwise he would be a five star".

Again, you keep focusing on the "physically gifted" part of a player's evaluation by the recruiting services when so much more goes into it.

Just curious, but you do realize that the highlight films posted by the recruiting services and players are just that...highlights. Period.

We don't see the plays where the players do nothing, drop passes, miss blocks, or just flat-out quit. That's why the coaching staff personally watches the players play and talks to the people that know them, including their opponents. That's also why they will have certain players at the top of their recruiting board when someone else may appear to be more "physically gifted"

One last point...you seem to go out of your way to disrespect Tech fans and insiders who have been following Tech's college recruiting a lot longer than you have. Why is that exactly?

 

[Sleepy T]

Wow. You just don't get it, do you?

According to the recruiting services "there are plenty of WRs across the nation that are more physically giftedthan Newsome otherwise he would be a five star".

Again, you keep focusing on the "physically gifted" part of a player's evaluation by the recruiting services when so much more goes into it.

Just curious, but you do realize that the highlight films posted by the recruiting services and players are just that...highlights. Period.

We don't see the plays where the players do nothing, drop passes, miss blocks, or just flat-out quit. That's why the coaching staff personally watches the players play and talks to the people that know them, including their opponents. That's also why they will have certain players at the top of their recruiting board when someone else may appear to be more "physically gifted"

One last point...you seem to go out of your way to disrespect Tech fans and insiders who have been following Tech's college recruiting a lot longer than you have. Why is that exactly?

Rece Davis - Great points MayDay(TAE)! What is your rebuttal on that Dr. Lou (Foozball)
:ss:

 

[jgHokie]

this is just getting rediculous....