Smart Move by ASU to give Graham an extension?

[theboardref]

I know this is a random thought, but this has been bothering me for weeks. This is a guy that bounced around 3 different jobs in 3 years, 4 if you count leaving his high school program, and his extension is until 2018. What are the chances he even sticks around till then if offered another job? Personally I think they really jumped the gun, especially extending his contract after a win over a mediocre USC team, which has played better under Orgeron, but nonetheless. He is having success, don't get me wrong, and I'm happy ASU is on the rise because I am a fan of the program especially after 2005 with LSU. I'm not sold this is a guy you want to build a program around. Not sure how they can trust him, although they did pull a classless move with the June Jones incident.

 

[RegentDenali]

If he takes another job, his buyout would now be astronomical. So he isn't going anywhere for years.

Seems a bit early, but still it was a good move by ASU to lock him up and boost his yearly take, which also probably throws some more cheddar at the assistants as well which helps with stability. He's recruiting very well and they are playing really good ball this year.

With the PAC12 broadcast deals, our schools can now pay them very competitive salaries.

 

[theboardref]

I can sense the PAC 12 kind of turning a one of the most unstable coaching conferences behind the SEC. More because it is so strong top to bottom than anything else. Especially with a USC hiring coming up soon and they won't screw this up a second straight time. It is hard to consistently be the "top dog" in that conference. I think the only teams that will not be competitive at all in the next few seasons would be Colorado and Washington State. Only 3 teams in that conference below 500, speaks a lot about the top to bottom strength of the conference. There is definitely a clear cut line between the top and bottom teams though, but it is rare for that to not be the case with any conference.

 

[WABLTY]

1.) The non-hiring of June Jones from SMU wasn't a classless move by the AD. It was a booster mutiny to what would have been an extremely unpopular move. ASU just finished with Dennis Erickson. June Jones would have been seen as an extremely similar hire. It was also pretty suspicious that June Jones, a very well compensated coach for a mid major with a high buyout, was being pushed on ASU by a search firm operated by an SMU booster.

2.) Large contracts make it more difficult for a coach to leave for greener pastures. It's not like they have to pay if another team hires him away. The only drawback is that its possible they might not want him to be the coach in 5 years if he struggles, but that is the same anywhere.

3.) He isn't the most popular guy with the media and random fans due to the Pittsburgh exit (though there are different sides to that), but all signs point to him being a good coach that fields disciplined, well coached teams that has an excellent eye for top notch offensive assistants.

4.) It helps in recruiting.

 

[JahiiCarson_SqodGeneral]

I have said it before and I will say it again. Graham can't afford to leave this early his reputation will truly be deflated. And why would a program want a guy who just left another team after 1-2 seasons. If a program offers him and accepts they might not feel safe with Graham. Asu fans love Graham and everything he's doing but he does have a track record of leaving quickly. Let's see if he stays fingers crossed.

 

[theboardref]

Glad to have an ASU fans input on this, was kind of aiming for this.

Not saying not hiring Jones was classless, but the way it was dealt was kind of questionable to say the least. Unless I am not remembering things properly in which case I am wrong. I remember hearing he was offered the job and was set to take the trip to ASU and was told they pulled the offer.

I think the thing that makes me just scratch my head is the time of the extension, it seemed really pre-mature. Not saying he won't be a very successful coach, just saying: in the middle of the season after beating a down USC team just really seems like they jumped the gun.

I do agree though, the money they are chalking up to him will definitely make it hard for another team to snatch him, but what if down the road they decide to cut the cord? A lot of money to pay up. And yes this is coming from a fan of the LSU Tigers which just gave Miles that huge extension haha.

 

[JahiiCarson_SqodGeneral]

The way he's recruiting, the amount of alumni invested in him, and the amount of people around Asu who believe everything Graham says he deserved an extension. Now how we got Graham was lucky Lisa Love who was by far one of the worse athletic directors at the time had no idea what she was doing, and after not getting Kevin Sumlin she basically was looking and looking for coaches and she offered Julio Jones a contract but rumor has it alumni were going to drop there season tickets and not give money to the program unless they hired the right coach. Then she was lucky as hell to land Graham who even had a lot of doubters but has turned out so far to be a dream coach. Now she's gone and the Athletic Director for Asu Steve Patterson turned down a Texas offer. The PAC 12 is one of the better conferences why leave?

 

[WABLTY]

The June Jones non hiring was strange, absolutely. They seemed all set to hire him after they missed on Sumlin, right up until the money and messageboards found out about it, and then all hell broke loose. ASU had to backpedal, and the AD was shit canned shortly thereafter. It was an unusual thing to happen, but it's not like the ASU administration went out of their way to screw with poor June Jones. They were just vetoed by their bosses (the money).

The timing makes a lot of sense to me. The Pac 10 has been seen as USC's stomping ground. If a team is going to make a power play, this is the time to do it and any semblance of instability could be seen as a weakness. It functionally discredits rumors of Graham leaving for another job. He's not going anywhere unless ASU wants him gone or someone brings a huuuuge pile of money and a significantly better job.

As for if ASU regrets it due to underperformance in the future, that's a possibility, but it doesn't appear to be likely. Players have been markedly better coached since he arrived and they're winning again. ASU is coming off of one of its worst stretches in the last 50 or 60 years. They hadn't had back to back losing seasons since the mid 40s, before ASU was even really ASU. They've had more losing seasons since Koetter replaced Snyder as they had in nearly the previous 50. Now things are trending upwards and, provided this season finishes in the 9 or 10 win range, he'll have earned a season or two of good will anyways.

 

[JahiiCarson_SqodGeneral]

WABLTY in all honesty were you happy when they hired Graham? A lot of Asu fans lie and say they were.

 

[WABLTY]

No. I was extremely skeptical. I only had vague name recognition and the last I knew of him, his Pitt team had gotten tar and feathered by a bad Utah team.

 

[theboardref]

Appreciate the input wablty. The whole situation just came across as really weird to me especially because we saw ASU give Graham an extension and Kiffen be shown the door because of the same game. Opposite sides of the spectrum.

 

[WABLTY]

No problem. It's worth emphasizing that a key component in the breakdown of the June Jones hiring was that the AD was receiving assistance from a search firm (one of the principals of which was an ASU donor). Eastman & Beaudine. Beaudine was an SMU alum that helped bring the unhappy June Jones to SMU from Hawaii for a -lot- of money for a mid major. It was strange, then, that the very SMU alum that had brought Jones to SMU was trying to push him off on ASU with a large buyout after a few 7 or 8 win seasons.

Other boosters had been out of the loop up until late in the process- Then word got out and the shit hit the fan, because it was going to be an unpopular hire that made it appear like ASU was bailing out a mid major from only moderate success on a "splash" addition.

 

[RegentDenali]

June Jones had a great run in Hawaii. He ran the Run n' Shoot amazingly well, but it was against mostly garbage competition of the WAC. At his peak there, Boise St. was the only one that really offered them anything in the way of competition. His teams put up jaw dropping numbers at offense, but always hit the wall anytime they played anyone with a half way decent defense.

But as someone who grew up going to UH games, and my family still lives on Oahu, and still go to some of their games, most on the island had enough of Jones as a person. His list of off-field BS is a mile long which includes massive boozing, seen partying around town at all kinds of ultra seedy places, drunk driving accident that almost killed him, letting athletes get away with anything, runs his mouth off in very unclassy ways, and actually hooking up with co-eds while married, including knocking up a UH volleyball player. Too the point he got spotted out with his side actions a few times and Oahu is a small village. Word spreads fast on the island. It's not the place to cheat on spouses, especially if your as easily recognized as the UH HC.

But the school ignored most of it all when he was putting up those incredible seasons. But all of the success came with box cars full of baggage.

When SMU made the offer, he bailed quickly. While Hawaii has nose dived since he left, that's usual for that school. They always move in big waves at UH, no pun intended....

I think the high powered ASU alums were smart for doing enough background research on him to reject him.

I suspect for 2 very valid specific reasons:

1) I have serious doubts he would of been able to translate the run n' shoot to the PAC effectively. PAC Ds would of shut that down way to easily.

2) Him on a PAC campus like ASU with it's party atmosphere would be a really, REALLY bad idea.


Jim Mora was not the 1st or even the 2nd choice on UCLAs list, but he ended up being the right guy for the job in the end. Same I think goes for Graham. It's worked out perfectly for ASU. ASU dodged a bullet with not making Jones the HC.

 

[theboardref]

I completely agree I think June Jones would have been a bad fit. When I heard they were going after him the words out of my mouth were "why"?

 

[OregonDucks]

Nope. Once coaches get major extensions their performance immediately goes to poop.

Kirk Ferentz
Gar Pinkel (exception of this current year)
Mark Mangino
Charlie Weis
Bo Pelini
etc.

 

[WABLTY]

I completely agree I think June Jones would have been a bad fit. When I heard they were going after him the words out of my mouth were "why"?

Because the search was a mess in general. ASU was unprepared for it and after Plan A didn't work, it turned out that they didn't have a Plan B. Consequently, the AD found themselves winging it and accepting outside help that had its own motives. She in turn lost her job for the botched search.

 

[OregonDucks]

Because the search was a mess in general. ASU was unprepared for it and after Plan A didn't work, it turned out that they didn't have a Plan B. Consequently, the AD found themselves winging it and accepting outside help that had its own motives. She in turn lost her job for the botched search.

what was plan A? And how were they un prepared? Didn't they know they were going to fire Erickson??

 

[mrwallace2ku]

June Jones had a great run in Hawaii. He ran the Run n' Shoot amazingly well, but it was against mostly garbage competition of the WAC. At his peak there, Boise St. was the only one that really offered them anything in the way of competition. His teams put up jaw dropping numbers at offense, but always hit the wall anytime they played anyone with a half way decent defense.

But as someone who grew up going to UH games, and my family still lives on Oahu, and still go to some of their games, most on the island had enough of Jones as a person. His list of off-field BS is a mile long which includes massive boozing, seen partying around town at all kinds of ultra seedy places, drunk driving accident that almost killed him, letting athletes get away with anything, runs his mouth off in very unclassy ways, and actually hooking up with co-eds while married, including knocking up a UH volleyball player. Too the point he got spotted out with his side actions a few times and Oahu is a small village. Word spreads fast on the island. It's not the place to cheat on spouses, especially if your as easily recognized as the UH HC.

But the school ignored most of it all when he was putting up those incredible seasons. But all of the success came with box cars full of baggage.

When SMU made the offer, he bailed quickly. While Hawaii has nose dived since he left, that's usual for that school. They always move in big waves at UH, no pun intended....

I think the high powered ASU alums were smart for doing enough background research on him to reject him.

I suspect for 2 very valid specific reasons:

1) I have serious doubts he would of been able to translate the run n' shoot to the PAC effectively. PAC Ds would of shut that down way to easily.

2) Him on a PAC campus like ASU with it's party atmosphere would be a really, REALLY bad idea.


Jim Mora was not the 1st or even the 2nd choice on UCLAs list, but he ended up being the right guy for the job in the end. Same I think goes for Graham. It's worked out perfectly for ASU. ASU dodged a bullet with not making Jones the HC.

Good read RD.

I disagree to the point where you paint a bad picture on a Coach who is the "last one" who effectively knows the "Run-n-Shoot", which ALWAYS focused on the run 1st and pass 2nd. How you make a blank statement saying that doesn't translate to the PAC is beyond me. What the hell is Oregon running these days but the Run-n-Shoot in a "hurry-up" mode version. Many Pac schools run high scoring type offenses and J Jones would too AND be effective doing it. Fact is Jones learn from the best about the Run-n-Shoot and there is NO DENYING that.

As for J Jones's "off-field" antics, whose to say here say is the gospel. NOT denying EVERYTHING you have posted, but am just saying Hawaii is a small rock surrounded by water and gets old quick living there in my OP. Infidelity? What the hell are you saying, his "character" can't be trusted to do his job on the field? Please, non issue here in my OP. Fact is ASU took a long hard look and the fit wasn't right for them. NOT because ASU thought J Jones would run amuck amongst the student body and their parties.

I always like J Jones, not for his off field antics, but for he brings to the table in the form of football knowledge. We as humans make mistakes thru out our lives as people. The only hope one has is, "Did we learn from our mistakes and move on?".

 

[asu_08]

I was hoping they would wait until the offseason but it makes sense that they did it when they did it to help with recruiting. I'm sure a lot of kids and their parents were very skeptical of playing for a coach with his history.

Regarding June Jones I don't think his coaching ability or his offensive scheme was ever in doubt. The problem is he would have been another Erickson. He had a history of undisciplined teams and ASU needed a coach who could lay down the law.

 

[WABLTY]

what was plan A? And how were they un prepared? Didn't they know they were going to fire Erickson??

Sumlin