KGJ

[JohnU]

So we know Junior is going into the Hall as a Mariner.
That leaves the other question:

Since he didn't actually leave the Reds (was traded) ... does Cincy retire his number?
If so, which one -- 3 or 30?
His dad wore 30.

Junior had H of F numbers with the Reds until he got hurt and then got lazy.

He'd have broken Aaron's record for sure.

 

[Redsfan1507]

Agree KGJ deserves HOF.

I thought he was the best player in MLB when he became a Red, and dissapoointed after, so he's definitely a Mariner in the HOF bust.

A record like Aaron's is a record for a reason. It takes an unusual amount of years AND talent to achieve that. Most all-time greats wont achieve - as it should be. PED's spoke to BOTH handicaps- improved strength AND stamina/recovery from injury, which gave a decided edge on years. I'm not certain KGJ didnt get some PED help, but would argue he might have played more if he had. He hit a lot of HR. I suspect Bonds and A-Rod might not hit that many without PED's.

If Barry Bonds dad, Bobby, had Barry's "conditioning routine" he wouldn't have been washed up at 36- the same age Barry was hitting over .350 with a gazillions HR. He hit more HR after 35 than he hit before 35- a ridiculous pace that made a mockery of baseball's feigned ignorance of PED's.

On the same note, Piazza was an Andro user, like McGwire, before it was banned. So, why did they deny / hide using ? Because legal or not, they knew they were cheating. That's why...they shouldn't get the HOF, IMO.

The problem is, a lot of old school BBWAA voting members were dropped- because of age, disability, death or disinterest, and newer members who don't remember MLB without PED's, think it's no big deal. The % rose because of fewer votes, and Piazza got in...Those voters have a different standard for integrity than those pre-PED students and stewards of the game had. I believe those that voted for Piazza aren't truly students or stewards of the game, and have those traits and similar lack of integrity and also have the self serving attitude that Piazza and other PED abusers had. It's sad. It's another dirty page turned in the book of the PED conspiracy.

I blame Bud Selig, and the owners that put and kept him in the commissioners chair, most. I think they've done irreversible damage to MLB, that makes Pete Rose's failing pale in comparison. They continue to profit from PED impacts. Pete can't hit a fungo for a paycheck. What are they going to do, ban owners and dirty MLB officials ? There is often no justice in this life. Maybe that's why religion is important- at least those that believe, can hope there is justice after they die. There sure as He'll is less justice in the BBWAA these days.

 

[JohnU]

So do we hang his number on the ballpark facade?

 

[Hit-n-Run]

IMO, Retiring KGJ's number would be similiar to believing Tom Seaver's number should be up there. HOF career with decent numbers as a Reds player, but probably short of consideration by most fans based solely on stats accumulated as a Reds player.

KGJ stats as a Reds player are very similiar to Eric Davis. IMO, most fans don't think of ED as worthy of the honor and KGJ wouldn't be in the discussion without his Mariners' resume.

 

[Redsfan1507]

I agree with Hit-n-Run.

Griffey as a Red isn't the guy they are inducting in the HOF- that guy was a Mariner. I think KGJ was a good enough Red for the Reds little HOF, definitely a good enough career player for the MLB HOF, and good enough to have his MARINER number retired in Seattle, but not hanging in GABP. IMO, Frank Robinson was a better Oriole than Red, but WAS a NL MVP with the Reds, so I think his number is justified in GABP, but not really Jr's.

Unfortunately, many of my memories of KGJ as a Red, are disappointing.

 

[JohnU]

I think anybody who makes the H of F, if he played *SUBSTANTIAL* time with the Reds, ought to be honored somehow, and the Reds Hall is one way. The problem with Griffey is that he had 2 numbers, one of them worn by his dad, who did leave the Reds as a free agent, not as the result of a trade.