How we know Babe Ruth wouldn't be as good today (Shane Bieber news is the hint)

[msgkings322]

I'm not saying Babe Ruth wouldn't be a good player. I suspect with his build and batting eye he'd be a Prince Fielder with better batting average type today. One reason is of course the much lesser level of talent he competed against...no black people of course but really no Latins or Asians or any other foreigners. Today the guys who can play from all over the world compete in MLB, not just white American guys who mostly had to work side jobs in the winter.

The more important reason is the evolution of pitching. In Ruth's day pitchers threw a lot more innings, and with far fewer types of pitches. A good pitcher would have a fastball and a curve and maybe one other pitch. The Bieber TJ surgery news shows this, Today guys get that surgery almost as a matter of course, because they throw 4-6 types of pitches each putting strain on their arms and leading to surgery. In Ruth's day throwing 95 mph was a big deal, now half of the pitchers can do that and many throw 100. There's sliders and change ups and slurves and sweepers and 2 seamers and 4 seamers and so on. Not to mention seeing fresh relievers every game vs the norm in his day when guys basically pitched 7-9 innings every game.

Ruth would be a good player, multiple all star, maybe HOF level. But not the sport-dominating legend he was.

 

[Fountain City Blues]

At this rate, the AL Central is gonna get so bad the Royals could win it.

Ok, I lied.

 

[Shanemansj13]

At this rate, the AL Central is gonna get so bad the Royals could win it.

Ok, I lied.

Anyone has a chance but the Shit Sox

 

[broncosmitty]

Edgy.

But nonsense.

 

[msgkings322]

At this rate, the AL Central is gonna get so bad the Royals could win it.

Ok, I lied.

MLB Network just said Royals starters lead the league so far in ERA and WHIP and IP lol

 

[msgkings322]

Edgy.

But nonsense.

100% obvious fact, rebut if you have a counterargument

 

[Fountain City Blues]

MLB Network just said Royals starters lead the league so far in ERA and WHIP and IP lol

That bullpen stinks and the starters won’t keep it up. Might be a problem for shitty AL central offenses though.

 

[msgkings322]

Forgot to add another piece of evidence, there's a reason guys don't hit .340+ anymore (the reason stated above, pitching is so much better). Ruth would not have a lifetime average of .342 if he played today.

 

[Cedrique]

I'm not saying Babe Ruth wouldn't be a good player. I suspect with his build and batting eye he'd be a Prince Fielder with better batting average type today. One reason is of course the much lesser level of talent he competed against...no black people of course but really no Latins or Asians or any other foreigners. Today the guys who can play from all over the world compete in MLB, not just white American guys who mostly had to work side jobs in the winter.

The more important reason is the evolution of pitching. In Ruth's day pitchers threw a lot more innings, and with far fewer types of pitches. A good pitcher would have a fastball and a curve and maybe one other pitch. The Bieber TJ surgery news shows this, Today guys get that surgery almost as a matter of course, because they throw 4-6 types of pitches each putting strain on their arms and leading to surgery. In Ruth's day throwing 95 mph was a big deal, now half of the pitchers can do that and many throw 100. There's sliders and change ups and slurves and sweepers and 2 seamers and 4 seamers and so on. Not to mention seeing fresh relievers every game vs the norm in his day when guys basically pitched 7-9 innings every game.

Ruth would be a good player, multiple all star, maybe HOF level. But not the sport-dominating legend he was.

It's an absurd discussion IMO. When you say Ruth wouldn't be as good today you have to explain how that would occur. Are you saying if we somehow plucked Babe Ruth from that orphanage in 1912 (or whatever) and stuck him in spring training in 2024? Or do we give him some advantages of todays players and do some immaculate conception thing where he's born in the early 2000s to a family that gets him on travelling teams where he grows up playing in tournaments and working out and eating healthy and shit?

Baseball has been evolving for over a decade and Ruth was a pioneer in the way power hitters approach the game today. The home run wasn't used as the weapon it has become until Ruth started hitting tons of them. Today's players have the benefit of the 100+ years of players that came before them. But he played in a different time. He sacrificed 141 times! How many plate appearances did Mike Trout waste on a sacrifice?


And furthermore, how long do you think most of the pussies playing in the 1910s with no air travel, limited electricity, outhouses, etc?


So in conclusion, Get The fuck off My Lawn!!!!!!!!

 

[Cedrique]

I'm not saying Babe Ruth wouldn't be a good player. I suspect with his build and batting eye he'd be a Prince Fielder with better batting average type today. One reason is of course the much lesser level of talent he competed against...no black people of course but really no Latins or Asians or any other foreigners. Today the guys who can play from all over the world compete in MLB, not just white American guys who mostly had to work side jobs in the winter.

The more important reason is the evolution of pitching. In Ruth's day pitchers threw a lot more innings, and with far fewer types of pitches. A good pitcher would have a fastball and a curve and maybe one other pitch. The Bieber TJ surgery news shows this, Today guys get that surgery almost as a matter of course, because they throw 4-6 types of pitches each putting strain on their arms and leading to surgery. In Ruth's day throwing 95 mph was a big deal, now half of the pitchers can do that and many throw 100. There's sliders and change ups and slurves and sweepers and 2 seamers and 4 seamers and so on. Not to mention seeing fresh relievers every game vs the norm in his day when guys basically pitched 7-9 innings every game.

Ruth would be a good player, multiple all star, maybe HOF level. But not the sport-dominating legend he was.

Sorry I got carried away and forgot to ask--what was the Shane Bieber news?

 

[msgkings322]

It's an absurd discussion IMO. When you say Ruth wouldn't be as good today you have to explain how that would occur. Are you saying if we somehow plucked Babe Ruth from that orphanage in 1912 (or whatever) and stuck him in spring training in 2024? Or do we give him some advantages of todays players and do some immaculate conception thing where he's born in the early 2000s to a family that gets him on travelling teams where he grows up playing in tournaments and working out and eating healthy and shit?

This is a fair point and the only real rebuttal.

Baseball has been evolving for over a decade and Ruth was a pioneer in the way power hitters approach the game today. The home run wasn't used as the weapon it has become until Ruth started hitting tons of them. Today's players have the benefit of the 100+ years of players that came before them. But he played in a different time. He sacrificed 141 times! How many plate appearances did Mark McGwire waste on a sacrifice?

Point being humans get better at almost everything over time, especially sports. Ruth would be a very good/great player today but not the sport dominating colossus he was.

And furthermore, how long do you think most of the pussies playing in the 1910s with no air travel, limited electricity, outhouses, etc?


So in conclusion, Get The fuck off My Lawn!!!!!!!!

Like most sports arguments there's no way to be sure. But the changes in pitching are real and the decline in batting averages are real too.

 

[msgkings322]

Sorry I got carried away and forgot to ask--what was the Shane Bieber news?

Having TJ surgery (mentioned in OP as an example of how pitching is different today)

 

[Cedrique]

Having TJ surgery (mentioned in OP as an example of how pitching is different today)

Damn, I didn't even know that happened. He had 2 great starts this season. I did see the Trevor Story injury live though. That was horrifying.

 

[WiggyRuss]

This is a fair point and the only real rebuttal.

Point being humans get better at almost everything over time, especially sports. Ruth would be a very good/great player today but not the sport dominating colossus he was.

Like most sports arguments there's no way to be sure. But the changes in pitching are real and the decline in batting averages are real too.

I mean- I think to a certain extent your OP is obvious.

If I am not mistaken one year Babe Ruth hit more HR than any single team.

Well- maybe he could out homer the Guardians of last year. lol.

 

[YourFriendGannon]

On a somewhat related note - I recently saw a comment declaring that Jeff Suppan would not be in the league in today's game, that he would get shelled with his stuff (topping out around 90 without great movement). I couldn't really argue with it but it kind of irked me. A substantial number of Suppan's peers didn't have markedly greater stuff than him. Some of them would go to Driveline or whatever and try to adapt.

 

[Mebert]

Normally you need ESPN and JJ Redick for these kind of hot takes.

 

[navamind]

Pitching is so much better and I think today's ballparks simply aren't as suited for higher batting averages sans Fenway/Coors. Triples are slowly becoming an endangered species, which really sucks IMO. Not to mention defensive players today are probably much better than they were during Ruth's era as well

 

[Mebert]

Pitching is so much better and I think today's ballparks simply aren't as suited for higher batting averages sans Fenway/Coors. Triples are slowly becoming an endangered species, which really sucks IMO. Not to mention defensive players today are probably much better than they were during Ruth's era as well

The issue with these arguments is every time you get the assumption that legends don't benefit from the modern advantages. Drunk obese Ruth smoking in the dugout is not as dominant. Ruth with modern understanding of nutrition and training methods I am confident still dominates.

 

[Cedrique]

The issue with these arguments is every time you get the assumption that legends don't benefit from the modern advantages. Drunk obese Ruth smoking in the dugout is not as dominant. Ruth with modern understanding of nutrition and training methods I am confident still dominates.

Imagine if he played in the 90's and got the benefits of some of those "trainers" and their "supplements"....

 

[Picklerick 2.0]

I'm not saying Babe Ruth wouldn't be a good player. I suspect with his build and batting eye he'd be a Prince Fielder with better batting average type today. One reason is of course the much lesser level of talent he competed against...no black people of course but really no Latins or Asians or any other foreigners. Today the guys who can play from all over the world compete in MLB, not just white American guys who mostly had to work side jobs in the winter.

The more important reason is the evolution of pitching. In Ruth's day pitchers threw a lot more innings, and with far fewer types of pitches. A good pitcher would have a fastball and a curve and maybe one other pitch. The Bieber TJ surgery news shows this, Today guys get that surgery almost as a matter of course, because they throw 4-6 types of pitches each putting strain on their arms and leading to surgery. In Ruth's day throwing 95 mph was a big deal, now half of the pitchers can do that and many throw 100. There's sliders and change ups and slurves and sweepers and 2 seamers and 4 seamers and so on. Not to mention seeing fresh relievers every game vs the norm in his day when guys basically pitched 7-9 innings every game.

Ruth would be a good player, multiple all star, maybe HOF level. But not the sport-dominating legend he was.

Impossible to predict. Stupid thread is stupid.