Flyers All-Star Break Review

[Cobiemonster]

Thoughts on the Flyers at the break? Better team than what you thought they would be going into the season? Can they make a push for the playoffs and get in?

I think since Ghost came up, it changed some of the dynamics with this team - their defense was more mobile and it helped out some of the forwards - that's when this team started to play better

There are still inconsistencies as a team - can't win 3 or 4 in a row and then go back to square one by losing four in a row - if they keep doing that the rest of the season, they won't get in - also, the offense needs to improve up and down the lineup and that is a question mark

Still have a lot of games left in the last two plus months of the season so they'll need both goalies and they'll need more depth scoring

 

[awaz]

Thoughts on the Flyers at the break? Better team than what you thought they would be going into the season? Can they make a push for the playoffs and get in?

I think since Ghost came up, it changed some of the dynamics with this team - their defense was more mobile and it helped out some of the forwards - that's when this team started to play better

There are still inconsistencies as a team - can't win 3 or 4 in a row and then go back to square one by losing four in a row - if they keep doing that the rest of the season, they won't get in - also, the offense needs to improve up and down the lineup and that is a question mark

Still have a lot of games left in the last two plus months of the season so they'll need both goalies and they'll need more depth scoring

Nice post Cobie, agree 100%.

As for my review, the Flyers are right about where I thought they'd be coming in to this season. I have to say, they're going about it a little differently than I expected them too. I'm shocked their PP is terrible. I'm floored their 5 on 5 GAA is 4th BEST in the NHL. I thought for sure those two stats would be exactly the opposite. It's what gives me faith in Hakstol though. The fact that he can take the defense he has and be 4th best in any defensive stat is credit to his system. Scoring 5 on 5 and the PK I expected to be abysmal, and they are.

Biggest Surprise: Has to be Gostisbehere. I've been looking forward to him putting on a Flyers jersey for 2-3 years, but to have as big of an impact as he's had, this soon, is incredible.

Biggest Disappointment: The PP. No question. If the Flyers could manage the 21.4% PP the had from 2012-2015 they'd have 7 more goals. With the number of close games the Flyers have had, it's not out of the question that those 7 goals could mean 8 more points in the standings. That would put them 1 point back (2 games in hand) of 2nd in the division and 3 points clear of the last wild card spot (1 game in hand).

 

[Cobiemonster]

Nice post Cobie, agree 100%.

As for my review, the Flyers are right about where I thought they'd be coming in to this season. I have to say, they're going about it a little differently than I expected them too. I'm shocked their PP is terrible. I'm floored their 5 on 5 GAA is 4th BEST in the NHL. I thought for sure those two stats would be exactly the opposite. It's what gives me faith in Hakstol though. The fact that he can take the defense he has and be 4th best in any defensive stat is credit to his system. Scoring 5 on 5 and the PK I expected to be abysmal, and they are.

Biggest Surprise: Has to be Gostisbehere. I've been looking forward to him putting on a Flyers jersey for 2-3 years, but to have as big of an impact as he's had, this soon, is incredible.

Biggest Disappointment: The PP. No question. If the Flyers could manage the 21.4% PP the had from 2012-2015 they'd have 7 more goals. With the number of close games the Flyers have had, it's not out of the question that those 7 goals could mean 8 more points in the standings. That would put them 1 point back (2 games in hand) of 2nd in the division and 3 points clear of the last wild card spot (1 game in hand).

I think without a doubt, Dave Hakstol is the right coach for this team right now - they're playing well defensively and with some of the mixing and matching with this team, it makes it look even better - at the very worst, it would help boost trade value for certain players that may not be long term fits but have looked better here because of the way they've performed

Ghost showed immediately in his first game this season that he was worth keeping the rest of the season - it was amazing that there was even talk of sending him back down even for cap reasons - anyone know who was intelligent enough to realize what was going on knew that it would be a mistake to send him down for any reason - sure enough, his play has continued to be terrific

A lot of the power play issues stem from the lack of a second unit and it goes back to the overall lack of scoring depth and why they're in the bottom five in the league in goals per game - at some point they will need more than the same handful of players to make contributions or it will be easy to shut down those top players

There are teams in the conference not looking so good right now and that's why the Flyers stand a chance but some of those teams can pick it back up in no time if they put together a run - Tampa's a perfect example of a team that was middling for a few months and then they went on a seven game winning streak and they are now back in the thick of things in their division - the most important thing for the Flyers is to not go on prolonged losing streaks

 

[lasgop8]

Biggest surprise: Neuvwirth looking like a starter which gives us two solid starters. Crazy to think since we haven't had one solid starter in years.

Biggest disappointment: The offensive numbers as a whole. Gee being our best offensive player is tied for 29th in the league with Jake next ties for 41st.

 

[Retroram52]

If we could just shore up our PP and get it consistently going and stop this losing to crappie teams on a regular basis. I'm interested to see how Hakstol handles the second half of the season in obtaining corrections from the players in these two glaring deficit areas. Maybe shuffling the lines may help. We shall see. We are getting closer to moving into the playoff teams and that is ahead of my expectations for this team this year.

 

[Maverick426h]

I'm not too worried about the offense, despite the still unimpressive numbers. We've managed to net four goals nine times in the last two months. The power play is heating up too with six goals in the last four games.

Get guys like Mason and Couturier healthy and we can make a run at the 2nd and 3rd seeds in our division, let alone the wild cards.

And for God's sake, get some revenge on the Pens and start beating the worst Nhl teams. If we can just improve on those two things, this will be a lot easier moving forward.

No matter who you are and how you feel about this team, you have to admit that we've been highly competitive across the last 10-11 games. All losses by just one goal (or via shootout) and some big wins over big time teams.

 

[4thstreet]

I'm not too worried about the offense, despite the still unimpressive numbers. We've managed to net four goals nine times in the last two months. The power play is heating up too with six goals in the last four games.

Get guys like Mason and Couturier healthy and we can make a run at the 2nd and 3rd seeds in our division, let alone the wild cards.

And for God's sake, get some revenge on the Pens and start beating the worst Nhl teams. If we can just improve on those two things, this will be a lot easier moving forward.

No matter who you are and how you feel about this team, you have to admit that we've been highly competitive across the last 10-11 games. All losses by just one goal (or via shootout) and some big wins over big time teams.

Every team in the eastern conference with the exception of Washington(for now),can be overtaken for a playoff spot.

There is no reason IMO,for them not to make the playoffs
.I believe they will get their shit together in the 2nd half,and have a nice playoff seeding.

 

[JBM73]

I still reiterate my position that I really don't want this team to make the playoffs, as that would be counter-productive to the goal of eventually winning a Cup. It's clear that this team just doesn't have the depth at forward or on D for that latter goal to happen. Hextall should stick with his plan of building a Cup contender the right way, which means using this season to figure out who is going to be a long-term fit in Hakstol's system and who isn't. Continue to move out guys who aren't part of that long-term plan for picks and prospects at the trade deadline. Give a few more of the prospects a taste of the NHL towards the end of the season so that they're ready to compete for jobs next season. Target 2017-2018 as the first year to be filling significant remaining gaps with free agents and making a real push for a Cup. The basis is being laid. Let's stick to the new plan, rather than continue the "we have a chance to win every year" mantra that has led to 40 years of futility.

 

[EVille3]

I still reiterate my position that I really don't want this team to make the playoffs, as that would be counter-productive to the goal of eventually winning a Cup. It's clear that this team just doesn't have the depth at forward or on D for that latter goal to happen. Hextall should stick with his plan of building a Cup contender the right way, which means using this season to figure out who is going to be a long-term fit in Hakstol's system and who isn't. Continue to move out guys who aren't part of that long-term plan for picks and prospects at the trade deadline. Give a few more of the prospects a taste of the NHL towards the end of the season so that they're ready to compete for jobs next season. Target 2017-2018 as the first year to be filling significant remaining gaps with free agents and making a real push for a Cup. The basis is being laid. Let's stick to the new plan, rather than continue the "we have a chance to win every year" mantra that has led to 40 years of futility.

I don't know. I think you can push for the playoffs during your rebuild. I don't think they have to tank in order to rebuild. Everyone on the roster pushing for the playoffs would provide the same evaluation to see who fits the system as losing would, so why not. I agree they shouldn't be making any win now moves this deadline, but to put a timeline on a rebuild by stating they shouldn't think of contending for 2 years seems somewhat unprofessional. Quick turnarounds are more common than not. Going to the bottom of the well and building a consistent winner doesn't always turn out as hoped (see the Oilers).

 

[Maverick426h]

I'm not sure that we really want to say everything we've been doing over the last 40 years as a team has been the wrong way to go. We've made more Cup Finals appearances than any team that is not an original six franchise. Honestly, I am proud of that fact.

I know I wasn't alive or old enough to care for a lot of the losses, but we came up against some true dynasty teams in those contests. I'm talking about the Canadiens, the Islanders, Gretzky's Oilers and more recently I think you can definitely add the Red Wings and Blackhawks to that group too.

Besides, I think the experience of making the playoffs with a lot of younger players is being very much devalued here. We're not going to one year just make a sudden run to the Cup with a bunch of rookies and second year players. It may have to start now with a loss in the 1st or 2nd round.

 

[chy1127]

If the PK and PP don't turn around, we will not have to worry about the Playoffs. Too muck talent to be at 78% PK and 17.5% PP. We finally improve on 5 on 5 play and special teams suck. Frustrating.

As for the future, we have 9 forwards, 5 Dmen and 2 Goalies under contract. The hope was Vinny would retire and the salary retained would come off the books. The way he is going he may think he can keep going. The 9 forwards includes Umberger but he is prime for a buy out. I think Schenn will be re-signed. That leaves 4 forward spots.

The 5 Dmen includes A Mac. Streit or Schultz could be moved at the trade deadline. Streit has been a PP specialist but Ghost has taken that spot. With young options and cap space, A Mac could see time on the 3rd pairing. A hell of a lot for a 6-7 Dman but we really don't save with the cap with him in the AHL. He can be a serviceable 6 or 7.

As for Goalie, we are set.

Hexy has done a great job freeing up spots and cap space to get younger.

 

[Maverick426h]

If Voracek truly gets it going while Simmonds and Schenn continue to score, you have to think that the top power play unit will start to produce a lot more often.

I mean it already seems like other teams are studying it and trying to figure out how to shut it down when it's only operating at 17.5%. Why? They see the dynamic of Ghost, G and Voracek and how potentially unstoppable that could become. If those three are able to consistently get each other the puck and make the right decisions, Simmonds and Schenn could be large pylons and we'd still score often.

That said, those two guys are far better than pylons and if Simmonds is left open, G or Ghost should continue to get him the puck. He really wreaks havoc in front. Besides, dumping the puck low to Simmonds leaves someone else open for a one-timer after the defense shifts. I don't think Simmonds and Schenn are the best passers in the world, but they don't really need to be and we can work around that.

 

[awaz]

I definitely still sell at the deadline. No way in hell I'm moving future pieces to try to help today's team. But guys like Gagner, Medvedev, Raffl, White, even Gudas or Manning, I'd absolutely move them if you can get good pieces for them. I'd consider moving Streit too, but I think the real value in moving Streit is at next year's deadline, or possibly the draft this summer.

That doesn't mean you can't roll out a lineup and try to be competitive and make the playoffs. If you find good trades (for draft picks or prospects) move the guys listed. But don't move them just to miss the playoffs.

 

[Cobiemonster]

I definitely still sell at the deadline. No way in hell I'm moving future pieces to try to help today's team. But guys like Gagner, Medvedev, Raffl, White, even Gudas or Manning, I'd absolutely move them if you can get good pieces for them. I'd consider moving Streit too, but I think the real value in moving Streit is at next year's deadline, or possibly the draft this summer.

That doesn't mean you can't roll out a lineup and try to be competitive and make the playoffs. If you find good trades (for draft picks or prospects) move the guys listed. But don't move them just to miss the playoffs.

Totally - the Flyers need to move as many pieces as they can if the value is there - anyone who thinks this team is a legitimate contender is crazy and at best they make the playoffs and are one and done - yes, they can still try to roll out a competitive lineup but there are players that better be moved if the value is there

 

[Retroram52]

Yep, I agree with the prevailing sentiment here. Moving people just for the sake of trading players makes little sense for this team as we are getting close to really taking a legitimate next step but if a good trade presents itself and makes the team better now and into the future, we'd be stupid not to oblige.

 

[wbon22]

There really are some distinct phases. There is the Pre-Ghost period, the Ghost and then the post trade.

Before they called up Ghost and Hakstoll turned him loose, the Flyers looked old, slow and out of step with each other. This is as much to do with the team learning a new system and the loss of Mason early on to family issues. Players were hesitant and it showed.

Once Ghost was brought up the tempo of the games changed. Yes, there were nights that the rest of the team seemed to be skating in mud, but there was always that flash. It seems to have been infectious because other members of the team have started to play more and more with his jump, even if they don't have his skating ability.

After the trade the entire team seemed to take a deep breath. Brayden Schenn was not the little brother of the defenseman anymore, he was the Schenn. Not having Vinny around seemed to lighten everyone's outlook. Sure, he was a pro and class act...but he was not playing and it had to have been hard.

As for the standings, the Flyers are about where I thought they would be. Sure, the fan in me wants them to be doing better, but the realist in me knows that this team is a work in progress. It is possible they could get white hot and get back into the playoff race and maybe even make a little run...but that would be the worst thing that could happen. Like the run in 2010, they have too many needs and just because a team makes a playoff run doesn't mean they aren't a mess.

Looking ahead, I think the next week or two after the break will help determine how much of a seller the Flyers are at the deadline. Do they clear out even more or stay the course. While we know there are a number of defensive prospects on the horizon, the real need for top 6 forwards is not going away. The Flyers are about where I thought they would be though not necessarily from the route I expected. Where they go form here only time will tell.

 

[Retroram52]

Spot on wbon!

 

[chy1127]

I still think Simmonds help turn it up a notch. When her started defending/standing up for teammates. The whole team seemed to come together.

 

[wbon22]

I still think Simmonds help turn it up a notch. When her started defending/standing up for teammates. The whole team seemed to come together.

Funniest thing is that it was Gagner getting tuned standing up for a teammate that really started that...or was it Bellmare...and then Simmonds did let it be known that the top 6 were not going to be pushed around either. It did help the team as a TEAM come together.

 

[JBM73]

From Bill Meltzer yesterday:

"Couturier alone isn't the difference between winning and losing, but his presence at least keeps the team out of some mismatches when the top line isn't on the ice. It is not entirely coincidental that the team is 2-5-2 in the nine games he's missed to date and 19-11-4 when he's been available."