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Series Thread: 6) Miami Heat vs. 3) Philadelphia 76ers

bksballer89

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The kings never completely bottomed out, and the T-wolves went a decade without hitting on a lottery pick other than Kevin Love. I mean between 2009 and 2013 they drafted Jhonny Flynn, Ricky Rubio, Wesley Johnson, Derrick Williams and Shabazz Muhammad. Only in 2014 did they start drafting better(counting Wiggins as that even though he technically wasn't a T-wolves pick). And the magic have made some bad decisions ever since they started landing in the lottery(2013). Traded away Oladipo and Sabonis, traded away Saric for Payton, drafted Hezonja, etc.

I agree. There's just too much at risk for my liking because if you don't hit on your draft picks, it extends your rebuilding period another 3-5 years which is why I'm more of a fan of rebuilding through free agency/trades and through the draft. It is a huge risk to build strictly through the draft. It worked out for Philly but for a lot of teams it does not.
 

tlance

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But this doesn't always work. Look at the Kings, t-wolves, & Magic as great examples of this not working

They have not done it. They have just sucked every year and the trades they have made didn't return the right kind of assets. The Cousins trade was a horrible return.

It was the MCW trades and deals like it that drew the ire of the media.
 

tlance

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I agree. There's just too much at risk for my liking because if you don't hit on your draft picks, it extends your rebuilding period another 3-5 years which is why I'm more of a fan of rebuilding through free agency/trades and through the draft. It is a huge risk to build strictly through the draft. It worked out for Philly but for a lot of teams it does not.

That is just it. You have to stick with it until you get those stars. Even if it takes 10 years. Almost nobody has the stomach or the patience for it, but it will work if the team holds out for legit superstars and trades the quality pieces that aren't on that level. Eventually you get at least 1.
 

ericd7633

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I agree. There's just too much at risk for my liking because if you don't hit on your draft picks, it extends your rebuilding period another 3-5 years which is why I'm more of a fan of rebuilding through free agency/trades and through the draft. It is a huge risk to build strictly through the draft. It worked out for Philly but for a lot of teams it does not.

So when the Sixers were "trying" to win between 2000-2013 the best free agent they were able to land was a guy on the wrong side of his prime, coming off a significant injury and had to overpay to get him. The sixers were just ridiculously poorly run between 2001-2013 and it was capped with the worse trade in NBA history.
 

Bolts

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Robinson was well past his prime by the time Manu and Parker got drafted. I would not even come close to saying Robinson was a super star at that point. They're not franchise superstars, but both are players that are going to be in the hall of fame. If the Spurs don't hit on those picks, Tim Duncan doesn't have 5 rings.

Hell, the Spurs were smart to trade for Kawhi when they did; the latter of whom was a a mid-1st round pick.

It's great to say, suck for a prolonged period of time so that you can get a couple of marquee players. However, that doesn't always work out. The Kings have sucked for well over a decade (sorry @Bolts). The Suns have been abysmal since Nash was traded. The Magic have been god awful for nearly a decade now. At some point, you have to have some sort of direction not related to tanking.
It works if you suck way more than anyone else(hello 76ers) and don't mess up your picks. The Kings have drafted McLemore, Jimmer, Trob, Stauskas(who was at the game yesterday) over guys who are all star or even all NBA caliber players. They even got Whiteside but he was too young to make an impact especially on the Kings. Stupid trades like the one that sent IT to the Suns or the one with Philly just compounded the problem. The Magic are the same, some bad picks mixed in with bad trades. Throw in that awful Biyombo deal and you're not gonna have much success. The Suns are bottoming out and have been the last 2 years to try and build a contender, which could work. It's easy to turn it around when you draft 1st or 3rd 4 years in a row which Philly has done. None of the other teams have gone full tank like that.
 

ericd7633

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It works if you suck way more than anyone else(hello 76ers) and don't mess up your picks. The Kings have drafted McLemore, Jimmer, Trob, Stauskas(who was at the game yesterday) over guys who are all star or even all NBA caliber players. They even got Whiteside but he was too young to make an impact especially on the Kings. Stupid trades like the one that sent IT to the Suns or the one with Philly just compounded the problem. The Magic are the same, some bad picks mixed in with bad trades. Throw in that awful Biyombo deal and you're not gonna have much success. The Suns are bottoming out and have been the last 2 years to try and build a contender, which could work. It's easy to turn it around when you draft 1st or 3rd 4 years in a row which Philly has done. None of the other teams have gone full tank like that.

Yeah the Kings were really never truly awful(bottom 2) during their stretch since they last made the playoffs. Before Cousins they had Ron Artest and Brad Miller for those couple seasons. Then Cousins made them somewhat viable enough to not be that awful. Plus they could never build around him after drafting because as you mentioned they missed on every pick since then, and made dumb decisions outside of just bad drafting.
 

Bolts

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Yeah the Kings were really never truly awful(bottom 2) during their stretch since they last made the playoffs. Before Cousins they had Ron Artest and Brad Miller for those couple seasons. Then Cousins made them somewhat viable enough to not be that awful. Plus they could never build around him after drafting because as you mentioned they missed on every pick since then, and made dumb decisions outside of just bad drafting.
They could have had Demarcus, Kawhi, and Lillard together....if only.
 

flyerhawk

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It works if you suck way more than anyone else(hello 76ers) and don't mess up your picks. The Kings have drafted McLemore, Jimmer, Trob, Stauskas(who was at the game yesterday) over guys who are all star or even all NBA caliber players. They even got Whiteside but he was too young to make an impact especially on the Kings. Stupid trades like the one that sent IT to the Suns or the one with Philly just compounded the problem. The Magic are the same, some bad picks mixed in with bad trades. Throw in that awful Biyombo deal and you're not gonna have much success. The Suns are bottoming out and have been the last 2 years to try and build a contender, which could work. It's easy to turn it around when you draft 1st or 3rd 4 years in a row which Philly has done. None of the other teams have gone full tank like that.

Exactly right. There is a huge difference between consistently drafting top 3 and consistently drafting top 10. The hit rate is dramatically better with the former.
 

Taddy Mason

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You didn't answer his question though.

What you guys need to understand about @TurnUpTheHeat is he looks at it from a different perspective than the rest of us because he is a season ticket holder and has been for several years now.....which is much different than most of us who maybe go to 1-2 games per season at most and are not investing in season tickets yearly and are just watching our favorite team on TV
I've never been in the position to be a season ticket holder and the tickets I'd be able to afford would be a shit view. As it were, I prefer to just watch from home. With that being said, I enjoyed watching the process era sixers. There was a brief period at the end of the one season when most of the young cats that were being counted on to turn it around were hurt and the product was largely garbage, but I liked Point Jakarr, Tony Wroten could get to the hoop against anyone, unfortunately, he was never able to finish. I always wonder if KJ McDaniels wouldn't be more relevant now if he chose to take the Hinkie special, rather than have his mom talk shit from the crowd and eventually get traded away. On that subject, don't see many Free Okafor shirts around.

But if the question was how did you like watching the product on the court (sorry, just jumped in and haven't been following), those teams came out every night and competed. They were obviously outclassed on the talent front, but the team was usually in it during the fourth quarter until the other team decided to on. The years of mediocrity prior just started to feel like you were watching the same game every night with no growth. They'd beat the teams they were supposed to, lose to those they were supposed to, etc... There was no hope for ever doing anything in the future. It was 8th seed or bust purgatory. Plus they had some shitty coaching decisions throughout the year, been very happy with Brett.
 

eaglesnut

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Team future is def looking bright, but it doesn’t erase what had to be endured to get there.
As a fan and STH, I wouldn’t support it.
:fuck2give:
It was a joy.

Blame the pathetic league structure.
 

eaglesnut

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Gotta give you props for that because I thought you were nuts.
Sixers slaughter fools. We even did it earlier in the year, but we would give it all back. Now we don't. Hence, 17 wins in a row. Every slow-minded Heat fan wanted to point out the opponents, but all that mattered was the Sixers learning how to manage themselves.
 

Taddy Mason

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Sixers slaughter fools. We even did it earlier in the year, but we would give it all back. Now we don't. Hence, 17 wins in a row. Every slow-minded Heat fan wanted to point out the opponents, but all that mattered was the Sixers learning how to manage themselves.
well, it's been two-fold. one was the bench getting better with the additions of Marco and Ersan, so they had the fire power to keep on scoring with the second unit (not to mention the addition of Fultz), the second was they started to limit their turnovers. On that front, I think the subtraction of Joel hoped on the second half of that win streak. Sometimes I think he can get too caught up in a matchup and try and force things.
 

eaglesnut

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I disagree.

They actually got somewhat unlucky.

They were worst in the league for years, yet always seemed to pick 3 or 4.

They got Embiid because he was damaged goods and the teams ahead of them didn't want to risk it. They hit the lottery once and drafted Simmons, then traded up to get Fultz.

What sets the 6ers apart is that they were willing to take risks on injured players like Embiid and Noel, and they were also willing to blow it up on the fly multiple teams when they realized the guy they took was not the franchise star they coveted.

Cleveland got lucky hitting number 1 3 times in 4 years. Philly earned this.
Well said. The way Cleveland got those picks is a disgrace to the game. And the way Miami was built was even worse.

Good thing all that bullshit is behind us now. No mercenary bullshit. A true team rises.
 

TurnUpTheHeat

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Well said. The way Cleveland got those picks is a disgrace to the game. And the way Miami was built was even worse.

Good thing all that bullshit is behind us now. No mercenary bullshit. A true team rises.


So far its 1 playoff win.
Rise a banner, then get back to us.
 

bksballer89

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Best thing about the playoffs is it doesn't matter how many points you win or lose by, they all count the same.

Sixers didn't win 3 games last night because they won by 27
 

Bolts

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Best thing about the playoffs is it doesn't matter how many points you win or lose by, they all count the same.

Sixers didn't win 3 games last night because they won by 27
The series hasn't even started yet.
 

Sparhawk

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Eh, I guess I kind of see it with Philly now. I did forget that Philly was quick to give up on certain players like Noel - which turned out to be a good move. But again, I couldn't go through 5 years of purposefully tanking.

Hard to know if they would have tanked last year if Simmons doesn’t get hurt.
Regardless, Hinkie started the Process at the 2013 draft, so it only lasted three years.
 
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